After having been a passionate Pavonista for some years I put this aside when my new La Valentina came last year. Having owned both a Europiccola and a professional, I wanted to try the ever discussed E-61HX, to see what commodities it could offer with it's 40-something Lbs of weight. Not having faced any disappointments with it, I was in for a difficult time recently because I was about to move to Iceland, and transporting this boulder up here, seemed to be quite a challenge.
So when I found an old Pavoni on spanish E-bay it both seemed nostalgic and convenient to go for it.

It came the other day, and the big parcel contained a sleeping beauty, that yet had to be awakened..
It turned out to be one of the oldies, probably from the 60ies or seventies. Full of scale and the chrome seemed pretty wasted. Had to descale it with vinegar, since descaling agents apparently don't exist in Iceland (don't think they have calcium in the water)
After descaling ( worked fine with vinegar!), I was in for some serious polishing, and the chrome was actually a lot more well preserved than I first thought. Here it is:


As you can se, it's a the model where the grouphead is attached with four bolts to the boiler, which has the same size as the professional, it does not, however has a pressure gauge on top of the sight glass. Moreover the grouphead itself seems a bit different than on the newer pre-millenium versions. Someone once told me, that in the old models, they used to have a termosyphon-ish system, which has now been reintroduced in the millenium.
Furthermore there is only a minimo-massimo switch and no thermostat. When temperature is reached there is a hiss from the OPV which indicates that pressure is reached, and as far as I know, then you just brew, while putting the switch to minimo.

Now was the time for heat-up, it warmed up fine, I was surprised by the hiss, since I first later read this is intentional in these models, and brewed my first cup. Came out ok, with crema of descent thickness, there was however a leak in the upper parts of the piston. So I decided to disassembly the grouphead ( a thing I normally did with the other used pavonis I've had, to check the gaskets). Here is the grouphead



The O-ring at the showerscreen looked OK, but when I tried to get the showerscreen of, by applying force to the top of the piston, nothing happened, could not by any force loosen either O-ring or showerscreen.

I noticed that the showerscreen has a brass-ring in the eccentric part towards the O-ring, as you see here:



I haven't seen this on my other Pavonis, and has no idea of how this is attached with the rest of the group, so this could be why I can't loosen it.

So, has anyone a clue on how these oldies are constructed in terms of the group-head?
Could be interesting to see photos or diagrams of other machines of these decades, and get some experiences to get on with.
So any knowledge would be appreciated, I don't dare to just apply more force, in risk of breaking something that might prove impossible to replace.

Best regards

Ulrikmo
Ps: Hope you'll be able to see the photos, have never tried to upload images before..

Your photos are OK, but my poor La Pavoni knowledge will not help you. As far as the minimo / maximo switch I had a similar model and I would switch to minimo -from Maximo- to brew- as soon as the pressure vent started to his- . Then if frothing of milk was required switch back to maximo and crack the steam wand open to know when I had enough steam up to work the foam.... Good luck in Iceland and keep in touch with us Ulrik???? . Nice little machine.

greg

Usually the shower/dispersion screen is held on by the primary gasket in the grouphead for Pavonis. If you flip the grouphead upside down you can press down on the piston shaft to make it pop out. Is that not the design of yours? The brass ring would be a nice deterrent to screwdriver gouging which I have seen on too many machines. Best of luck on this.

Hi Greg and Steve
Thanks for your replies. I did already try putting my full weight on top of the piston, it comes dowv to the dispersion screen, but this doesn't move the slightest bit. Can't get the O-ring loose either, it seems glued, which I have however never experienced before. As far as the brass-ring is concerned, I tried with a screwdriver got this only left scratches.. Don't know why it's there I have seen it in other of the more new models..
So I'm kind a stucked here

ulrikmo wrote:Hi Greg and Steve
Thanks for your replies. I did already try putting my full weight on top of the piston, it comes dowv to the dispersion screen, but this doesn't move the slightest bit. Can't get the O-ring loose either, it seems glued, which I have however never experienced before. As far as the brass-ring is concerned, I tried with a screwdriver got this only left scratches.. Don't know why it's there I have seen it in other of the more new models..
So I'm kind a stucked here :o

I have seen some similar photos on other threads. A guess is that the copper piece is a one piece or welded soft wire ring that is expanded into the groove around the screen by peening the wire with a small punch and hammer. The reason for this guess is that the tiny flats are equidistant around the perimiter.
If you are unable the get the piston out any other way, use a dental tool 90 degree bent pick to hook a litttle of that copper ring toward the center of the screen and remove it carefully. You may be able to slip it back into the groove using a wood punch.

good Luck
Richard / espressme

espressme wrote:I have seen some similar photos on other threads. A guess is that the copper piece is a one piece or welded soft wire ring that is expanded into the groove around the screen by peening the wire with a small punch and hammer. The reason for this guess is that the tiny flats are equidistant around the perimiter.
If you are unable the get the piston out any other way, use a dental tool 90 degree bent pick to hook a litttle of that copper ring toward the center of the screen and remove it carefully. You may be able to slip it back into the groove using a wood punch.
good Luck
Richard / espressme

Hello All, For ulrikmo
My Bad!
A gentleman backchanneled this information: It seems valid. I think "peacecup's" was the same removal method. I believe it is in the Amore thread as to a tool he ( peacecup) made from pipe to deal with the removal. Seems he also had a piston corrosion problem. Your machine looks almost brand new! When the piston is removed, It would help us all if the dimensions were posted as a mechanical drawing here for others with these machines!

From: ideor
To: espressme
Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 10:30 pm
Subject: waking up vintage pavoni Quote message
hello,

your find is not a pavoni. it was manufactured by marcfi of madrid prior to 1977. these were sold as mini-marcfi, la graziella, la cara and other names. there are early type and late type in these. your example is early type. they changed them in 1977 and put an inox shroud over the boiler and made the elements enter the boiler from the top instead of from the bottom as on your machine.

ducetta removal: the ducetta is machined in. do not pry on it. it is permanently fixed to the bottom of the cylinder. in this group the cylinder threads into the group body just as it does on original europiccola as manufactured 1960-74. when you remove the pf gasket you will see two pin holes on the pf gasket seat. these are used to turn the cylinder. a tool must be made. do not attempt to use a punch and mallet as this will simply damage the pin holes. both holes must be engaged at the same time. i have had a machinist friend make a tool for this procedure. the cylinder comes out counterclockwise and goes back in clockwise. working on this group is just like doing the original europiccola of 1960-74. it is easier because the group comes off the boiler. on the old europiccola the group is permanently affixed to the boiler so the base must be pivoted out of the way in order to do the job.

production of these machines ceased about 1983 under threat of legal action from pavoni. the manufacturer is still going but makes only commercial equipment today.

hope this assists you a bit. good luck with your find.

ideor

Many thanks ideor!
Sincerely
Richard / espressme

Hi Guys
Thanks for your great replies, it could be that the brass-thing is threaded into the group as you are suggesting. Can't however find any holes or somethings where you could use a homemade device to unscrew it.

Espressme: You say you've seen similar photos, do you remember where? Tried to locate the quotation from Ideor, but didn't find it in the Amore thread. When I lift the lever, heaps of water flushes out with a tremendous velocity and force I haven't seen in my other pavonis. I take this as a symptom of worn out gaskets. So if I could just get this thing apart..
I know Jim Schulman has been restoring old Pavonis, don't know if he's reading this thread, and since I'm new to this forum ( which I find a great one, haven't had so many qualified responses in other occasions on coffegeek), I don't know whether it's possible and ok to contact one person directly for questions?

On the side of the group the number 3245 is engraved; does anyone know if it's possible to use this for finding out more about manufacturedate? Seems from Ideors quote that the groups in the first models of europiccolas couldn't be detached from the boiler, so mine must be from the post 1973 period, although it's with four screws at group, or how? I'm a bit confused about this..

Another thing: Is there any knowledge of the temp-stability of these oldies? The waterjacket should be an advantage, but what about the fact that temp is controlled solely by the expansion valve, doesn't this give any problems, or is this mechanical temp-control as good as an electrical (thermo/pressostat)? Suppose it could be worn after these years, but cant really check it before gaskets in group are fixed, and I've got a normal velocity of water coming out.

By the way, cleaned the inside of sight glass from scale today by removing the top-knot. It seems possible to fit a gauge on it, since it's differently constructed than the newer europic's and resembles a professional in that sense. That would answer the question about pressure/temp.. Will have to get one shipped from Denmark, Pavoni is a foreigner here in Iceland!

Cheers
Ulrik(mo)

ulrikmo wrote:Hi Guys
Thanks for your great replies, it could be that the brass-thing is threaded into the group as you are suggesting. Can't however find any holes or somethings where you could use a homemade device to unscrew it.

Espressme: You say you've seen similar photos, do you remember where? Tried to locate the quotation from Ideor, but didn't find it in the Amore thread. When I lift the lever, heaps of water flushes out with a tremendous velocity and force I haven't seen in my other pavonis. I take this as a symptom of worn out gaskets. So if I could just get this thing apart..
I know Jim Schulman has been restoring old Pavonis, don't know if he's reading this thread, and since I'm new to this forum ( which I find a great one, haven't had so many qualified responses in other occasions on coffegeek), I don't know whether it's possible and ok to contact one person directly for questions?

Ulrik(mo) :P

Hello Ulric,
your machine may be similar in construction to the LeCara. There is a thread on the dismantling of one.
Here's the thread:
http://www.home-barista.com/levers/info-needed-on-la-cara-t1868.html
Good luck!
Sincerely
Richard

Hi Espressme
Thanks for the link, that really got me somewhere! I've got a reply for Dan at that thread, I'm trying to correspond a little there as well, in order to move on in the process.
I will post some pics here in this thread, when I'm doing progress with the machine.
Might take a while to get it up running, probably have to order gaskets from Denmark, and some of them are apparently not convertible with the newer Pavonis, which I'll though yet have to see.
Has anyone tried cutting there own gaskets?
Cheers
Ulrik

Hi Guys
Sorry for letting this thread rest a bit, I've been quite busy, but not all my time has been spent working at the emergency ward, there was time for fixing up the Pavoni as well, as you will see by the following..
Just to resume from last time: I was waiting for gaskets, in the meantime tearing out my hair in frustration over how to get the waterjacket loose, which was kind of stuck.
Got some good advices from Ideor and other fellows, but finding a pipe in the right dimension and grinding it down as suggested, seemed as to much work, since I had no tools at all. Ended up loosening it with this:





As the pics show, I was meet by a rather nasty sight, the inside of the group full of rust, I had to use heaps of WD-40 to release the waterjacket with the tools which fitted perfectly in the two holes in the bottom of the waterjacket..Mounted the group upside down on the boiler in order to be able to work with it, it took some strenght to get that damned jacket off!
As you can see, the pistongaskets were full of rust after years of decay, glad I din't drink to many shots from them!!
What concerned me most were the hole you se in the top of the group right beside where the piston enters the group.
It turned out to be almost an inch deep, strecthing to aproximately half an inch to the outside of group. Started wondering how long time it would take it to work it way all the way through leaving me with a defect group.. So used some restless nights innovating this rather simplistic solution:


Cut out two rings from the thin metal you get from take away boxes or similar, and fitted them so the piston could go through it.
I needed something thin in order to be able to put in the waterjacket, which goes all the way to the top of the inside of the group, and something easy to work with. Might not endure a decade of use, but will check them after some months..
Got the gaskets from my friend Thomas in Copenhagen and they all fit the old model, except the O-ring between PF and Group, and the one between boiler and group, luckily these were intact and in an OK condition, since they're not in contact with water.. Had some pics of the parts after proper cleaning, but unfortunately they seem to have dissappeared from my computer, probably deleted by my girlfriend

After reassembing everything I was exited to bring it up to temperature and pull my first shot. Lifted the lever and just got a big hiss of steam coming out, OOps, forgot to put the pipe running from the boiler into the grouphead back in
This was however quickly done, and now I'm getting good shots and with a high consistency as well, and no leaking!
Will post some pics at a later occasion of the shots..

I must say, after having worked four different versions of the Pavoni ( millenium, pre-millenium, Pro and this oldie) that the waterjacket doesn't really do any difference. Since it's made from brass it just increases the total amount of heat conducting metal increasing the never ending issue of over-heating, and with only a minor advantage in waterdistribution. Water still comes out very quickly compared to the other pavonis I've tried. This might be a pressure issue, since there is no presso-stat, and with no pressuregauge, you don't really now where you're brewing, you're in the hands of a fourty year old spring in the securityvalve.. But still, the coffee tastes good and has got the right temperature, so I think I'm getting right temperature, but cannot get more exact measure before a pressuregauge is mounted which will be the next project. The problem mostly occurs, when you want to pull more than one shot: should you turn it down on minimo from massimo, if you for example want to do two shots? If the boiler pressure drops substantially at first shot, there might not be enough pressure to force water through the pipe and into the group, and the only parameter you can work after is the hiss of steam from the security valve..

Well think I will get used to this, that is in fact also the charm of lever machines, they are in a way quite unique, you cannot walk into another levonistas home and pull as good a shot on his darling as he can, although you have the same model at home. I find them all to be slightly different from one another, that's probably what attracts many of us as well, getting to now your machine and work her in a way where she will give you full value for money

So hope you're all enjoying december, not to stressed by the up-coming X-mas and all the presents you didn't buy yet, remember: there's always the hope of a new tamper under the tree!!

Cheers
Ulrik