I don't get something. Pressure profiling seems to be all the rage these days but it's been an inherent feature in direct levers like the Cremina 67... So why is it that home barista folks are so inclined to seek out very expensive solutions just for this capability in a pump machine? Is there some advantage over the pump machine versions? Personally if I wanted to play with pressure profiling there isn't a better machine that gives you as much control than a direct lever, so why not just buy a Cremina 67? I know while Cremina doesn't have an advanced, high-precision temp management solution, it's shot temp stability is built into the design and proven very reliable and repeatability is not at all an issue.

A Cremina and Vesuvius are in the same price ballpark for my area... plus 58mm is attractive given available options.

My guess is it's partly marketing and partly not understanding what exactly is pressure-profiling.

Pressure profiling is more than just about declining pressure (that is inherent to lever). It is also about delibrate and repeatable control (ramp up, ramp down etc), and this is not on most levers.

To be honest, pressure profiling is cool and is mostly useful for lighter roasts, but it is not the magic bullet to better espresso (thus my comment about misunderstanding pressure-profiling). It changes the extraction and subsequently the taste, but there's no clear cut whether the change is good or detrimental (apparently even for barista like Matt Perger).

Also, manual levers are....manual. It requires more effort to get in the right temp range, which is probably another reason.

If anyone wants to experience the effect of pressure profiling, my thought is there's no better than Portaspresso Rossa(Air). And you don't have to break the bank.

aecletec wrote:A Cremina and Vesuvius are in the same price ballpark for my area... plus 58mm is attractive given available options.

I was referring to the Cremina 67, which is the vintage model that costs much less.

Well fair enough, but where could I buy one?
I happen to be able to get an asbestos-free Vesuvius at several local retailers with warranty

The manual levers also have smaller and lighter portafilters. These are harder to use and don't instill the same feel as commercial quality 58mm portafilters.

Pressure profiling isnt all about exploring pre infusion and declining pressure
There are long slow ramp ups , flat pressure profiles ...These are easily repeatable on a Vesuvius , i don't have experience of if they are on a Creminia
I know there is one mod / thread on where its allows the pressure on the lever to be readably ...but this isn;t the case on a stock vintage machine ?
in the end do what floats your boat , beyond long pre infusion and flat pressure at different rates, I done use mine for much more else nowadays.
But the coffee sure is tasty

The 58mm size is also worthy to mention as I believe DrGary notes his 58mm lever tastes better than his smaller ones?

aecletec wrote:Well fair enough, but where could I buy one?
I happen to be able to get an asbestos-free Vesuvius at several local retailers with warranty

ebay have a lot of Cremina 67, Most 80's cremina is asbestor free +Cremina 67 never need to warranty

I must have been mistaken in seeing rebuild threads, then?