Received a new-to-me Europiccola yesterday, and older 200/800 pre-millenium model, and very pretty.

For the first pull I used the setting from my Ponte Vecchio Lusso—too coarse. So I closed up about three notches on my Macap grinder, and pulled a super sweet delicious shot . This was the teaser, it turns out, the shot to demonstrate what is possible and now elusive. Now, this machine is kicking my butt !

As mentioned about 1000 times already, this machine gets hot!

Well, I felt up for a challenge, and it looks like the La Pavoni has delivered.

Progress reports to possibly follow as the week progresses.

The shot I had yesterday that was super tasty was a Brasil Fazenda that I roasted six days ago to FC+. On the PV Lusso this has typicaly produced good body, full flavor, complexity, and generous crema. But with dialing in the new machine, I quickly burned through my stash. In a couple of days my freshly roasted new batch will be rested and ready to try, along with an El Salvador Orange Bourbon.

What I worked with today was Ritual coffee's Hopscotch, roasted three days ago. The local barista was kind enough to pull me a benchmark shot with his tremendous skill. This is a West Coast style of espresso, refreshing and elegant when properly prepared, though I do find it a demanding bean to work with—to my taste buds it has less body than a traditional espresso. The roast is on the lighter side and the flavors are bright and reminiscent of citrus. If it is not properly prepared it can taste a bit thin, and today my efforts tasted thin and hot. Typically, I have to grind this bean several notches finer on my Macap M4 than my home roasted beans that I have on hand, so a very fine grind is in order.

Tomorrow is another day and I will try again.

I'm not yet touching adjustments on the machine, and I don't know what is possible, but I am already wondering if one can turn down the heat on this machine. When it starts to hiss I turn the heat switch to low, and I feel as if I am trying to catch a ride on a sizzling bottle rocket. The cup is hotter than I am used to, though it is entirely possible my inexperience is fully at fault. I am reminded of this when I remember the one sweet shot I pulled yesterday.

When I bought this beauty I thought the description mentioned that the pressurestat had been adjusted to 1 bar, but I am now thinking that this must mean the boiler pressure release valve, at least that's where the steam comes out. So my most obvious heat adjustment controls when brewing are the 800 watt switch until steam spews, then 200 for a lower boil. That's still hot fast, so today I just went from 800 watts to 200 then promptly to off—and pulled a tasty shot with my Ritual Hopscotch roasted earlier this week.

This machine demands that you pay attention all along the way or suffer a hellish brew, and I am just at the beginning of getting to know the ins and outs. I am having fun for sure, and in so doing I have produced more sink shots in one day than I have in three years of using the Ponte Vecchio Lusso. Really it's what I expected, but I have this idea that when the shots are great on the La Pavoni they will be really enjoyable, and perhaps I will have learned something more about espresso along the way.

At one point I thought I might have a leak in the base, as there was water present at the edges. So I took the base apart, dried it, put it back together, and did a test run. The I unplugged the machine and peeked into the base—no water from obvious seals, but an impressive amount of condensation on the metal base stiffener just below the drip tray. So, this seems just a part of the design when operating in any but the driest of climates.

grong wrote:When I bought this beauty I thought the description mentioned that the pressurestat had been adjusted to 1 bar, but I am now thinking that this must mean the boiler pressure release valve, at least that's where the steam comes out. So my most obvious heat adjustment controls when brewing are the 800 watt switch until steam spews, then 200 for a lower boil. That's still hot fast, so today I just went from 800 watts to 200 then promptly to off—and pulled a tasty shot with my Ritual Hopscotch roasted earlier this week.

No pressurestat and the pressure release safety valve pressure is set by a small non-adjustable spring holding a little steel ball against a tiny hole in the boiler. Pretty high tech, eh?

grong wrote:I'm not yet touching adjustments on the machine, and I don't know what is possible, but I am already wondering if one can turn down the heat on this machine. When it starts to hiss I turn the heat switch to low, and I feel as if I am trying to catch a ride on a sizzling bottle rocket. The cup is hotter than I am used to, though it is entirely possible my inexperience is fully at fault. I am reminded of this when I remember the one sweet shot I pulled yesterday.

There are no machine adjustments, so you need to be creative. I'm experimenting with turning the machine completely off at the hiss and then back on before pulling the shot, (don't forget to release false pressure). When I hear the boiler start to gurgle again, I immediately turn off the machine and then pull the shot, (you only need enough boiler pressure to get one ounce of water into the group when the piston is raised). I'll need to get some espressme temp strips from Orphan, before I know exactly how this routine affects the temp of the group. I'm trying to find a way around doing the wet towel over the group maneuver.

Basically its a 1-2 shot machine - totally different than the PV. I had one on loan for a month or two. I just turned it off when it got close to ready. Made sure I had the basket prepared, then turned it on till just ready. No preheating of the group - it gets plenty hot on its own. When I got into a routine I could pull consistent shots - I wrote up a superficial comparison with the Export about two years ago.

The manual lever offers interesting possibilities, and I'm sure you'll enjoy it!

PC

I appreciate and thank you for the helpful responses. I now feel I have the heat issue more or less under control, largely due to your suggestions. I also read on another thread, posted by someone who had added a pressure gauge to the two-switch Europiccola, that when the machine starts hissing lightly it is around .8 bar and when it lets loose it is around 1. Judging by the gauge on my Lusso and how much water forces through when the lever is engaged at .8 bar this sounds about right.

I did pull a very nice shot today, but that was on my Lusso! As peacecup mentioned, these machines are very different—I am finding that to be true.

My current problem stage to work through is channeling, I think. All today, I am just not getting any good resistance on the lever, though I felt it once yesterday—the lever just pushes down quite easily, no drops too easily. But then the portafilter remains under pressure for several minutes, which I suspect is longer than necessary. So, I am guessing channeling is the problem, allowing a flow that is too easy. Help, please!

I have used grinder settings for what works on the Lusso for a start, and moved up and down step by step, several steps. While I have hit the mark a time or two with the Pavoni, it has only been by accident. The shots that look good started getting drips after about 5 seconds of preinfusion.

I am using a stubby tamper from Orphan Espresso. It has a flat bottom, and fits the basket with minimal clearance, a lovely fit. I am using a light tamp, about 8 pounds, polish, fresh beans, and the puck is clearing the screen so it is not being disturbed.

Advice is appreciated. Thank you!

John,
Tighten your grind, (the Europiccola needs a finer grind than the Lusso, you shouldn't see any drops of coffee during preinfusion), use WDT and make sure your beans are fresh is usually the consensus H-B advice for channeling issues. I'll add down dosing and Jack "peacecup" would surely suggest updosing. Try both.

Raise the lever until you see a few drops of water and lower it a bit until the water stops, then insert the portafilter. Slowly raise the lever all the way up, hold for 4 seconds then pull down slowly and evenly. Shoot for 30 pounds of lever resistance during the shot pull. I know you know a lot of this already because you have been on H-B as long as I have, to the day. An H-B site search of Pavoni techniques and dosing techniques will provide you with a plethora of info.

Dosing

Thanks, Fullsack. I will start fresh tomorrow, and follow your advice.

It's as if I know what to do, but like I am in zero gravity with this machine—with every adjustment I make, I get exactly the same result! It's a funny feeling, and I am sure I am just overlooking something. Thanks for helping me think it through.

I am experiencing a steep learning curve with this beautiful machine.

Raise the lever until you see a few drops of water and the lower it a bit until the water stops, then insert the portafilter.

Yes, I am probably disturbing my puck.

grong-

I have a 2-switch Europiccola with the added pressure gauge. I have found that my machine does not release from the pressure relief until my gauge is topped out, about 3 bar! Much more than the 0.8 you mention. Different machines may have different relief valves, so I would venture a guess that waiting for the hiss in your machine may not be a good indicator of proper temperature. I would try to add the gauge to your machine to get more consistent results.

The gauge also helps to repeat good results and avoid poor ones by allowing you to eliminate at least one variable and pull shots at the similar pressure and temperatures each time you brew. Using the high/low and on/off switches and watching the gauge can also let you keep the machine in the proper temp range and get more shots per session without a serious overheat.

Hope this helps-
Bill

Bill,
Assuming your pressure gauge is accurate, a 3 bar pressure reading would be worrisome. As I mentioned above, the pressure release valve is non-adjustable and regulated only by a small spring and tiny steel ball. I don't believe that set-up would be able to hold 3 bars of pressure, so something else could be going on, an obstruction from scale build-up or corrosion maybe. The highest pressure i've ever seen on a Europiccola or any other espresso machine for that matter, is less than half of that. I'd have it checked.

Richard's post from Fitting A Gauge On A Europiccola more likely pinpoints the problem:

espressme wrote:Hello all,
I just talked to Devon at "Espresso Parts"
http://www.espressoparts.com. He seems to think that the gauge would not work so well with the small volume boiler . What size is your boiler.
FWW, I did order a new sight glass screw and gaskets. I shall machine a gauge adapter to Silver-braze to the bunged up old one from the machine. that way, I would hope that the whole thing won't cause troubles that I didn't expect and if it does I have the new parts.
IMHO ( ha) could the problem with a gauge mentioned be due to the gauge somehow fooling the pressurestat on the newer machines???
And, I do have the new gauge and a similar size chrome plated gauge that should allow me to use its case.( got to change the hole pattern in the back.)_
Regards
Richard /espressme

More on retro fitting a pressure gauge to a Europiccola.here

Whew! Now I am getting good resistance that increases as expected with finer grinds/harder tamps. I can now move on to refining distribution and tamps.

The problem I was causing: With the portafilter locked in and the lever raised fully and held to the top, I was waiting 10 seconds. No matter the change in grind or tamp, resistance was almost nonexistent.

What seems to have helped immensely: With the portafilter locked in and the lever raised fully, let it lower to where it rests naturally and apply just a little pressure—do this as soon as the water has fully whooshed in. Lever resistance is now affected as expected with relation to changes in grind and tamp.

Now I think that refining the shot can begin.

Fullsack wrote:Bill,
Assuming your pressure gauge is accurate, a 3 bar pressure reading would be worrisome. As I mentioned above, the pressure release valve is non-adjustable and regulated only by a small spring and tiny steel ball. I don't believe that set-up would be able to hold 3 bars of pressure, so something else could be going on, an obstruction from scale build-up or corrosion maybe. The highest pressure i've ever seen on a Europiccola or any other espresso machine for that matter, is less than half of that. I'd have it checked.

I replaced it when I added the gauge... did a complete rebuild - gauge, gaskets, relief valve, descale, etc.

The old relief was the spring and steel ball, the new one is a spring and teflon(?) or some other white plastic instead of the ball. It has a leg that fits into the spring for a secure fit.

When it blows, it's hot! No damage though. This is a completely manual machine. If you look away for an instant, it will get you. There is no safety switch, just the non-replaceable thermal fuse for when you run the boiler dry.

grong wrote:Whew! Now I am getting good resistance that increases as expected with finer grinds/harder tamps. I can now move on to refining distribution and tamps.

The problem I was causing: With the portafilter locked in and the lever raised fully and held to the top, I was waiting 10 seconds. No matter the change in grind or tamp, resistance was almost nonexistent.

What seems to have helped immensely: With the portafilter locked in and the lever raised fully, let it lower to where it rests naturally and apply just a little pressure—do this as soon as the water has fully whooshed in. Lever resistance is now affected as expected with relation to changes in grind and tamp.

Now I think that refining the shot can begin.

It has been many sunrises since I used my picolla...
Your experience mirrors mine. I found that one raises the lever, let's the water flow in, releases the pressure on the lever, then ".....slowly...." pull the shot. If I put too much pressure on the lever, it tended to choke, too little pressure, and it pulls too quickly.
I also, have the non-tstat model with two switches....
This is basically a manual shift model that you have to double clutch once in a while. It is finicky, but once you find the groove it's a great feeling (or is it taste?)
Congrats on the machine grong!

edit: I also found that using an elektra microcasa a leva double basket will allow you to put in 12-14g. With the stock pavoni double basket I could only get in ~10/11 g. IIRC, I had to work the lip in to get it to fit - there's a thread in here somewhere about using the elektra double basket in the picolla

billm3 wrote:I replaced it when I added the gauge... did a complete rebuild - gauge, gaskets, relief valve, descale, etc.

The old relief was the spring and steel ball, the new one is a spring and teflon(?) or some other white plastic instead of the ball. It has a leg that fits into the spring for a secure fit.

When it blows, it's hot! No damage though. This is a completely manual machine. If you look away for an instant, it will get you. There is no safety switch, just the non-replaceable thermal fuse for when you run the boiler dry.

Yep, the teflon mushroom and the new spring will provide more resistance than the steel ball set-up, but 3 bars of resistance? Probably not. I still believe the accuracy of your pressure gauge needs further investigation.

Just checked the Europiccola since I keep it at work. 2.5 bars is the max of the gauge, and that's where the ball pops.

This is the second gauge, and both had the same reading during the relief pop-off.

peacecup wrote:Basically its a 1-2 shot machine - totally different than the PV. I had one on loan for a month or two. I just turned it off when it got close to ready. Made sure I had the basket prepared, then turned it on till just ready. No preheating of the group - it gets plenty hot on its own. When I got into a routine I could pull consistent shots - I wrote up a superficial comparison with the Export about two years ago.

The manual lever offers interesting possibilities, and I'm sure you'll enjoy it!

PC

Tried Jack's technique this morning, I think he nailed it. I turned off the machine at 6:45, when steam first started coming out of the safety pressure valve. My only deviation was to grind, dose, distribute and tamp after the warm-up was complete, so the shot wasn't pulled until 9:00 minutes after the start. The group was still hot to the touch and there was enough boiler pressure to fill the group and then supply pressure afterwards for flushing and cleaning.

After days of pitiful attempts, with the occasional mercy shot which helped motivate me to stay with the effort, I can now report five super tasty shots in a row, with two different beans—Brazil Fazenda and my Italian blend. When I can figure out exactly what I am doing that seems pertinent I will pass it along in this thread so hopefully it will be of some use to someone else.

For now few critical points in helping me to pull a dependably tasty shot on the pre-millenium two-switch Europiccola:

1. As Fullsack and peacecup said:

Tried Jack's technique this morning, I think he nailed it. I turned off the machine at 6:45, when steam first started coming out of the safety pressure valve. My only deviation was to grind, dose, distribute and tamp after the warm-up was complete, so the shot wasn't pulled until 9:00 minutes after the start.

If I let my 1 bar running valve get to blasting steam and then pull a shot, the fluid will pound the puck and and produce a shot hotter than tar on Texas asphalt, with a taste to match. When I hear the steam starting to gently seep out of the 1 bar running valve and I confirm brisk steam out of the steam wand, I just turn off the machine and get the shot pulled within the next minute.

2. No 10 second preinfusion with the lever held at the top—on my machine it would seem this will not allow any resistance to be built up at the puck in relation to grind fineness and tamp firmness (obviously this works for many and their particular machine, but there have been several threads with people who could develop no resistance at the puck no matter how fine they ground). Just take the lever to the top carefully, hear the group fill with water, and without delay draw down the shot.

3. Of course, fresh coffee! I am grinding just a touch finer than I do for my Ponte Vecchio Lusso (maybe 1 notch on the Rocky scale, and one or two notches finer on a Macap M4 scale), but not as fine by a couple of steps as I ground on my old E-61 Isomac Zaffiro vibe-pump machine.

Thanks to any and all, on this thread and others, who helped me get up to speed on my new-to-me Europiccola! I could not have done it alone, nor would I have persisted. I am so glad I did.

grong wrote:No 10 second preinfusion with the lever held at the top—on my machine it would seem this will not allow any resistance to be built up at the puck in relation to grind fineness and tamp firmness (obviously this works for many and their particular machine, but there have been several threads with people who could develop no resistance at the puck no matter how fine they ground). Just take the lever to the top carefully, hear the group fill with water, and without delay draw down the shot.

Nice John, this is a better technique than counting seconds. The often recommended 12 second hold used to give my shot a burnt taste.

If you are going to steam milk, you may need to turn the machine on again for a short period.

Another variable to consider is grams of coffee in the basket. Updosing verses down dosing might require some further technique tweaking.

Down dosing works for me because the volume of my shots are 3/4 of an ounce. If you want a full thick one ounce shot, you will need to updose.