joatmon wrote:Yes!

I used an hX machine for several years. I was never completely satisfied. The temp surfing, extraction times, dosing ... the coffee was generally good, but not great.
Cheers,

joat

I understand the 'different strokes for different folks' cliche and 'to each his own' but this is quite the slant to a prosumer selection of machines that can and do deliver great espresso. I'm not saying that other machines do not, but what I've 'bolded' in the quote is not the fault of the machine in most cases especially with prosumers. Also, extraction times and dosing are essentially the same things everyone adjusts no matter which machine... dependent on the coffee/grind.

What new model is available with PID and different side panels? The version from Chris Coffee, a Euro version, other?

With regards to temp control I run a La Cimbali M20 lever (direct draw as per the Pompei)and keep the Pstat quite (.06) low to help reduce the quick overheating that can occur on a single group lever- if I get a little flush happy my temps can soar over 205F pretty fast and the group takes about 10 minutes to cool back down. The PID would be useful in easily adjusting boiler temp though I have found the greatest single tool (aside from taste buds)in learning how to extract the most from my beast was a scace device and a few hours spent flushing and testing.

Tony,

I have over 8 years experience with espresso. I have used a variety of machines and I consider myself to be decent at the craft, but certainly not great, or even good. Before the Lambro, I always found myself adjusting something. With the hX machine, it seemed like getting the proper brew temp was the biggest problem. I'd say that 50% of my shots were good, 25% were very good, and 25% not so good. With the MCal, I'd say 60% were good, 20% very good and 20% not so good. With the Cremina, I'd say 60% were good, 10% very good and 30% not so good. To me, it seemed like the MCaL and Cremina were very sensitive to grind and tamp. My extraction times were all over the place if I didn't make frequent adjustments.

With the Lambro, I'd honestly say that 10% of my shots have been good and 90% very good. I made ONE adjustment to my grinder on the first day with the Lambro and not one since. I did adjust when playing with making a single but returned it to the former position when I finished. My pours all seem to stay in the 25 to 30 second range. I've used different coffees and some pour a little shorter or longer, but all seem to stay in the zone.

Now, I didn't get to be a better espresso puller overnight. In fact, right now I don't usually take much care in distributing the coffee before tamping because it just seems to work well with even a reasonable attempt at leveling. From walking up to my coffee station to leaving with a cup on espresso in hand is 1 minute. It seems so simple.

I have no machines to sell or cause to champion. I'm not trying to foster a Lambro Nation because frankly, there are so few in existence. I'm simply telling folks my experience and leave it at that, it is one man's experience.

Peace,

joat

galumay wrote:Thanks guys, seems the new model is the PID model anyway so its made the decision easier. As you say, the new model is more attractive as well with its swooshy side panels.

You will find that the older version is still available. Give Chris Kay at Paridiso coffee roasters a ring, he has been importing Izzo products for several more years and knows them well.

joatmon wrote:Tony,

I have over 8 years experience with espresso. I have used a variety of machines and I consider myself to be decent at the craft, but certainly not great, or even good. Before the Lambro, I always found myself adjusting something. With the hX machine, it seemed like getting the proper brew temp was the biggest problem. I'd say that 50% of my shots were good, 25% were very good, and 25% not so good. With the MCal, I'd say 60% were good, 20% very good and 20% not so good. With the Cremina, I'd say 60% were good, 10% very good and 30% not so good. To me, it seemed like the MCaL and Cremina were very sensitive to grind and tamp. My extraction times were all over the place if I didn't make frequent adjustments.

With the Lambro, I'd honestly say that 10% of my shots have been good and 90% very good. I made ONE adjustment to my grinder on the first day with the Lambro and not one since. I did adjust when playing with making a single but returned it to the former position when I finished. My pours all seem to stay in the 25 to 30 second range. I've used different coffees and some pour a little shorter or longer, but all seem to stay in the zone.

Now, I didn't get to be a better espresso puller overnight. In fact, right now I don't usually take much care in distributing the coffee before tamping because it just seems to work well with even a reasonable attempt at leveling. From walking up to my coffee station to leaving with a cup on espresso in hand is 1 minute. It seems so simple.

I have no machines to sell or cause to champion. I'm not trying to foster a Lambro Nation because frankly, there are so few in existence. I'm simply telling folks my experience and leave it at that, it is one man's experience.

Peace,

joat

Can I join your Lambro Nation, Jack?

I should point out that the real issue I was trying to tackle was not necessarily people posting very leading and subjective answers, but the fact that people should understand that one person's opinion can lead them to make a decision that may not yield the same outcome as was experienced for someone else. Like, I think it would be a very bad decision to go *only* go with a spring lever machine just because of your experience with HX machines, when someone else on these forums can just as easily post something that is the complete opposite of your experience without any delusion.

I have had an amazing time with my HX machine. I've had some growing pains, but now I understand *it* and I can yield espresso I love very consistently and that is the only thing that matters. It was an informed decision to buy as I knew the shortcomings of the HX system before I made the decision. Do I wish I had a double boiler? YES But not because I think I'll get more consistent espresso shots, but because I believe I'll be able to do what I can do now without the 'bull' of the HX machine...(assuming the DB life is paradise...)

Peace out Jack!