My "new" Cimbali Lever.

by **bgn** on Sat Jun 06, 2009 9:32 pm

I found a lever at my local Cimbali dealer and I bought it after he re-conditioned it. I had to choose between buying this or keeping my Cimbali Junior. Finding a buyer for my Jr. made me jump for the lever. I've always wanted one. I can't explain why. It is a M20L with a spring lever. For years I've heard people talk about drinking espresso (I mean without hot water, milk or sweetner added) but have never really understood this taste acquirement. Until now. After spending 10 years trying to dial in grinders, perfect dosing, tamping and roasting, my very first pull on this thing was the first time I've enjoyed a straight espresso. Ditto for steaming. I realize now that my Jr. had some issues that would make it a better steamer (it needs the pressure turned up a bit and a different steam tip), but my first attempt at steaming was better than any home steamed drink I've ever had. There are things I miss about the Jr. already, such as the ease of making coffee for a house full of people, and the short water path of the brew water in the HX system. But I think I'm not going to regret switching to the lever. When i can figure out how to reduce the pixel size of the picture of it so that it is legal to upload here, I'll post a shot.

by **IMAWriter** on Sun Jun 07, 2009 2:38 am

Congrats on your machine.
There are several free ware programs you can use to reduce the picture, including the software for your camera. Crop it as small as possible, then choose a "custom" option and lower the % till the file is a proper pixel.
Dan K will probably respond here.
Back to the machine. How many shots can you pull before it gets too "toasty?"
It's not HX, correct?

by HB on Sun Jun 07, 2009 9:45 am

bgn wrote:When i can figure out how to reduce the pixel size of the picture of it so that it is legal to upload here, I'll post a shot.

I've added some freeware suggestions to Posting images on HB.

by **IMAWriter** on Sun Jun 07, 2009 4:42 pm

HB wrote:I've added some freeware suggestions to Posting images on HB.

Thanks Dan. Fortunately, I "sort of " learned how to use Adobe 's Photo Shop version for dummies.

by **bgn** on Mon Jun 08, 2009 2:39 pm

This is the lever machine.

another

by **bgn** on Mon Jun 08, 2009 2:49 pm

IMAWriter wrote: How many shots can you pull before it gets too "toasty?"
It's not HX, correct?

This is so new to me. And I'm quite confused on this point. From my reading here I had assumed that the accepted wisdom, as per your questions also, is that these lever's had a limited use before the group overheated and there was no easy way to cool it down except to let it rest, or play with the on/off switch (i.e. turn the machine off while brewing). But the Cimbali dealer tells me that this machine has the opposite problem when pulling multiple shots. He says it cools down. He is refering to the water in the boiler, I assume and not the group head. I've not had occasion to pull more than 2 shots at a time so far, and this kind of use will be normal 99% of the time so I'm not too worried about it. I'm looking forward to learning lots through experience.
BTW, this machine has autofill, but it also has a very, very cool "lever" knob (the knob to the right of the power switch on the bottom of the machine) that pulls out and pushes down to manually fill the boiler. It is plumbed in, both boiler and drain.

What I have noticed, compared to my Jr. is a very slow recovery time when the boiler pressure is brought way down (like when I use the hot water tap to draw out 500ml of water to force a cycle). I assume this is because it has been converted to 110 from it's original 220 power.

Over all, a super, super cool machine to use.

by **GVDub** on Mon Jun 08, 2009 3:59 pm

If the 'conversion' from 220 to 110 consisted solely of putting a US-type plug on the cable, that would pretty much explain a slow recovery. Was the heating element or anything else changed, or just a different power cable? If its just a power cable, step-up xformers aren't that expensive and would make a world of difference in the machine's response time.

by **bgn** on Mon Jun 08, 2009 4:59 pm

the dealer that did the restoration simply said that he re-did the 110 conversion because whoever had done it initially had done a 'brutal' job. I didn't ask the details, but I think he just meant that he did a lousy job of putting a new cord on it. I'm guessing that it still has the same heater because I asked if there was any "issues" with it being converted to 110 and the dealer said that speed was the only issue. Now, forgive my ignorance, but when you suggest a 'step-up transformer,' and I believe you when you say this would make a difference, does this 'step-up' to 220? i.e. this would mean switching the power cord back to 220?

by **Bluecold** on Mon Jun 08, 2009 6:03 pm

It is an HX lever machine according to this diagram
So yes, it will cool down as you pull more shots with it.
Have fun with it. (i'd get rid of the plastic cover since the la cimbali lever group looks wicked* with the visible spring)

Don't forget to join the ranks of the LMWDP!

*not that that is a picture of an earlier boiler fed lever instead of your group. The upper part looks to be the same though.

by **IMAWriter** on Mon Jun 08, 2009 6:05 pm

I believe you'd actually be doing a step down from 220 to 110/120...so I believe you would put a 220 end (correctly wired) back on the unit, plug into the transformer (many which go either direction), and plug in the transformer into your 110/120.
I could be wrong here, especially if we don't know ig the actually UNIT was converted to 110, or JUST THE CORD.
Nice machine, BTW, looks solid as a rock, more like a commercial thing.

by **bgn** on Mon Jun 08, 2009 6:17 pm

Bluecold wrote:It is an HX lever machine according to this diagram

hmm. Interesting. The dealer that sold it to me said it was open to the boiler. What I understood him to mean when he said that this machine would run cool with heavy use is that doing shot after shot would draw a lot of cold water into the boiler and the heating cycle would not be able to keep up with proper brewing temperature water. Seeing how slow it is to recover when I draw a lot of water out through the tap, I can understand what he means.

by **GVDub** on Mon Jun 08, 2009 6:18 pm

Yes, a step-up transformer converters voltage from 110/120v to 220/240v. Most these days are step up/step down, meaning they can go either direction, as Rob pointed out. A 3000w one will run you about $125 or so. There are many available on Ebay and in any city with a substantial immigrant population that has applicance stores catering to that population.

If it is, in fact, still the 220v heater, and that's the only electronics in the thing, then running it on the proper voltage will make a real difference. Example, my old Caravel, a 220v unit with a 600w heater, takes about 45 minutes to get a full tank of water to temperature running on 110, but 12 minutes or less running on 220v.

It's not entirely necessary to change out the cord, as you can use a plug adapter, but it's much neater.

The first thing to make sure of, though, is exactly what they dealer who reconditioned it means when he says '110v conversion'. Just to be sure.

by **bgn** on Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:46 pm

45 minutes to heat up a Caraval? How big is the boiler?! This gives me a hint my machine is alright the way it is, even though it is slower than my Jr. It has a boiler about 4 litres and takes about 20 minutes to heat from cold.

by **IMAWriter** on Tue Jun 09, 2009 1:48 am

yep, Clarabelle heated up a nearly full tank in about 25 minutes, as I remember...room temp water...still, I always used my kettle...impatient soul that I am. :lol:

by **orphanespresso** on Tue Jun 09, 2009 5:42 am

Ah yes, very nice machine....seems very new, as in recent manufacture, as well. No matter how the voltage is set up 20 minutes to hot and ready to pull on a 4 liter boiler is about right. The element should be marked on the end plate 110 vs 220 and if it is marked 110v it has indeed been fully converted and not just rewired. If it reads 220v then the conversion is a simple rewiring from the two hots and a ground on 220v vs one hot, one neutral and a ground on 110 wiring. You should be able to visibly dieagnose the conversion, but most interesting is how does this function?

If you monitor the sight glass and the level of water does not fall when pulling shots or running water through the group then it is a standard HX type machine, with the water line feeding the group directly and passing though a boiler within a boiler. You can test this by turning off the water line valve and pulling the lever down....if water does not continue to stream out then you have this type of hx and with the valve open the water will eventually run cool from the group since the hx compartement withon the boiler can't keep up with the heating even though the boiler is still hot. If the water level in the boiler drops when pulling shots then you have some type of thermosyphon group. I wager the first, standard hx design.

Some people disable the gicar device (autofill unit) by unhooking the wires and run only the manual fill, this way there are no 'surprises' when the autofill kicks on and the pressure and temperature suddenly drop. We keep our boiler about half full to reduce warm up time, but it has to be at least half full in order for the hx to work properly. About the only time we fill the boiler all the way is when we are flushing out the old boiler water (and scale) which builds up since we only drink shots and only use the boiler as a steamer heating citric acid, cleaning parts in Joe Glo and steaming hand grinder boxes apart, not to mention scatting the cats away.

by **timo888** on Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:03 am

bgn wrote:From my reading here I had assumed that the accepted wisdom ... is that these lever's had a limited use before the group overheated and there was no easy way to cool it down except to let it rest, or play with the on/off switch (i.e. turn the machine off while brewing). But the Cimbali dealer tells me that this machine has the opposite problem when pulling multiple shots. He says it cools down. ... BTW, this machine has autofill ...

Most of the commentary and cooling kludges on this site relate to domestic, not commercial, levers. Yours is a commercial-class machine, and these typically have more massive groups with greater capacity to sink heat than the domestic levers do, and other features, such as the autofill you mention.

Autofill, as you know, brings cool water into the boiler, and this does have the effect of cooling the machine down when shots are pulled in close succession, unless the pstat has been raised sufficiently to cause a rapid temperature rebound.

One would set the pstat so the boiler temperature and rebound are appropriate for the duty the machine sees, whatever that may be. A caterer doing special events pulling milk drinks back-to-back would want the pstat set fairly high. If you're going to pull a couple of leisurely shots per day, you could keep it fairly low.

by **bgn** on Tue Jun 09, 2009 6:35 pm

orphanespresso wrote:If you monitor the sight glass and the level of water does not fall when pulling shots or running water through the group then it is a standard HX type machine, with the water line feeding the group directly and passing though a boiler within a boiler. You can test this by turning off the water line valve and pulling the lever down....if water does not continue to stream out then you have this type of hx and with the valve open the water will eventually run cool from the group since the hx compartement withon the boiler can't keep up with the heating even though the boiler is still hot. If the water level in the boiler drops when pulling shots then you have some type of thermosyphon group.

Thanks for this test. When I dispense water through the group by pulling the lever the boiler sight glass shows a drop in the boiler level right away. It is clearly pulling water directly from the boiler.

As for the manufacture's tag that is stamped on the front, it shows 220/360 with 1700 wattage.

Thanks for the help.


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