Posted in the FWIW mode . . .

My first true espresso machine, aside from one of those stove-top fiascos (which I paired with a stove-top steamer!), was a Pavoni Europiccola 8, what is now called the Europiccola EN. This was back in the mid-to-late 1970s, when the machine cost $299 new. (I noticed on the Pavoni website -- http://www.lapavoni.com/ -- that the MSRP is now €604,00 - $880.39 - £435,12 [or $719 @ WLL].)

After many years of seemingly endless frustration, punctuated by the occasional "agnostic shot," I was overjoyed to "move up" to a Gaggia (also $299, but in the mid-1980s -- the same model now is $299 . . . go figure!). Not only could I make better shots, but steaming milk was much easier (No. 1), and (No. 2), I could refill the water tank whenever it needed (i.e.: I didn't have to wait for the pressure to drop/bleed off, etc., etc., etc.). And having upgraded in the 21st century to a "prosumer" HX machine, I'm in heaven!

Believe it or not, I do understand -- at least theoretically -- the joys of a straight espresso pulled on a lever machine. But the quality of the espresso I pull now is better than most, and (IMHO) equal to all but the best, cafés out there.

Lever machines are not the ultimate, IMHO, but rather a wonderful, little, anachronism that deserve their own little corner of the universe in which they can be lovingly cared for, treasured, and used by those who choose to. But I don't for one moment believe that one is trading quality for convenience when one trades a lever for a pump in a home environment.

Cheers,
Jason




...split from Lever Espresso Machine Smackdown by moderator...

zin1953 wrote:But I don't for one moment believe that one is trading quality for convenience when one trades a lever for a pump in a home environment.

Steve has made similar comments about the finicky nature of his Europiccola he used for many years, but let's not make the mistake of painting with too broad a brush. Dave and I thrashed the Gaggia Achille for months and agreed on its "morning after" score of 8.0, one-half point higher than your La Valentina, which is also reviewed on this site. The Smackdown is only in its early weeks, but the Ponte Vecchio Lusso has every indication of meeting this same standard for ease of use.

This weekend I was talking with a local about his espresso equipment selection for Christmas. You would never have heard me say "you should consider a lever" to a newbie a few years ago since all my experience at the time was with the ones like your Europiccola. But after listening to him and going back and forth for an hour, we settled on a few choices, one of which included the Lusso.

What is a competitive thread like this doing in the Lever Espresso Machines forum? I vote that it be expunged back to Smackdown.

I disagree, Jason makes a legitimate comment that's more general than the Bench's purpose ("Behind the scenes of the site's upcoming equipment reviews."). It's good that the Bench research provokes discussion, but if they're not directly related to the review, I prefer to split them off so they won't get "lost" in pages and pages of background material.

My honeymoon with my Ponte Vecchio spring lever ended a year ago - I've been using it daily for two years. IT TOTALLY ROCKS! It is easy to use, very versatile, very consistent, and it makes great espresso. It is at least as easy to make great espresso on it as it is with a pump machine.

That said, not all levers or all pump machines are created equally. My relatively short time with a La Pavoni Pro convinced me that they are more finicky, less versatile, and less consistent than the Ponte Vecchio. They are capable of making great espresso though!

PC

zin1953 wrote:Believe it or not, I do understand -- at least theoretically -- the joys of a straight espresso pulled on a lever machine. ....

I don't for one moment believe that one is trading quality for convenience when one trades a lever for a pump in a home environment.

A good pump machine is no obstacle to making good espresso. Who said it was?

First sentence does not make much sense to me. I don't know what it means to understand joys...at least theoretically. Zin, are you talking about the "zen" of making espresso on a simple machine, lever and piston, or the pleasures of drinking good espresso?

Not all levers are manual levers, which do demand the barista's attention and immobilize the barista during the entire extraction. Spring levers are quite convenient. I would not say that pump machines are more convenient than spring levers. Nor would I say that pump machines are as reliable or dependable as spring levers. Nor would I say that pump machines are easier to use than spring levers.

Lever machines are certainly no anachronism. They make great espresso...quietly...and new ones can be bought retail in anno mmvii of the Common Era.

Regards
Timo

I sense that a lot of the frustration with the lever has to do with the boiler design, rather than just being a lever. The criticism tends to settle specifically on the la Pavoni models, being a single-boiler design. It doesn't seem there are that many complaints over the HX models.

That being said, the temperature of the grouphead on the Pavoni can still be reasonably managed and give consistent shots brew after brew. The temperature profile of the brew water is quite wide, hardly flat like an HX, but the resulting espresso, though different, is still quite pleasing.

Even though I have no need to upgrade, my only desire to look into other machines is just for comparisons (and speed).

timo888 wrote:Not all levers are manual levers, which do demand the barista's attention and immobilize the barista during the entire extraction. Spring levers are quite convenient. I would not say that pump machines are more convenient than spring levers. Nor would I say that pump machines are as reliable or dependable as spring levers. Nor would I say that pump machines are easier to use than spring levers.

A lot of broad brush strokes in your response. Which lever espresso machine? Which pump espresso machine? There are some lever espresso machines that require more skill than pump espresso machines and vice versa.

timo wrote:

Zin, are you talking about the "zen" of making espresso on a simple machine, lever and piston, or the pleasures of drinking good espresso?

, and

A good pump machine is no obstacle to making good espresso.

Which brings up a good question: Does the PISTON action of the lever machine actually help to make BETTER espresso, and therefore, IS a pump machine actually and OBSTACLE to good espresso? One might answer YES to both of these questions. Here's why:

The action of the piston, the face of which is a large, flat surface, forcing water through a "cake or puck" of ground coffee, would seem to lead to a more evenly-distributed (i.e. laminar) flow of water through the coffee. This would in turn lead to a more consistent and even extraction (every bottomless-PF lover's dream). Conversely, the spritz of water expelled at high pressure from an electric pump will tend to cause turbulence within the PF, no matter how hard the engineers try to re-create the laminar flow effect of the piston. Food for thought...

PC

Lever machines are not the ultimate . . .

oh yes they are

fwiw, the third generation of faema leva group design (used by futumat etc) produces coffee of higher quality than nearly any pump machine. The reasons that pump machines dominate in the commercial environment is that they are faster and easier to use in high demand conditions.