Hi guys, I've had my La Pavoni Professional (the latest millenium edition which returned to brass piston) for about 4 months now, my technique and routine are getting close to what I hoped to achieve, thanks to this great forum, with so many helpful people willing to explain.

Getting the Eureka Mignon was maybe my best move, but second to that, my latest move has really got me to the next level of control and precision.

I used to have the OE LCD Temperature Strip attached to the grouphead. I pulled my single basket 8 gram shots when the 85C started to fade and the 90C started to light up. Cooling the grouphead in between by dumping the naked PF (with double filter inserted) in cold water and hooking it back to watch the 95C turn back to black and the temp to settle somewhere between 85C and 90C (with the pstat resting between .7 and .8 ) for the next shot, I could pull shots all day long.

But certain beans need to be pulled a bit hotter or cooler, and also some of my guests have different tastes. On the LCD strip it was hard to tell if it was black or darkgreen or darkblue-ish etc, all depending on the light and what color sweater I was wearing which reflected in the strip aswell, so I guess I could say the temperature was set to +\- 8C.

Then I bought a simple IR thermometer just to try it out, even though others said it doesn't read off the shiny chrome grouphead. That proved to be true, but I figured out that with a little square of black electrical tape on the grouphead, I can now aim and read VERY precisely the grouphead temperature!
Now I got a good idea of what's going on during heat up, pull and cool down.
For example, when I turn on the Pav and leave it idling for an hour, the temperature of the grouphead will settle at exactly 92.5C. This is the perfect temperature to pull a shot with the Caffe New York Espresso Extra, with 5% Blue Mountain. But with Caffe Molinari Cinque Stelle, I need to cool it down to 85C before the pull. This works surprisingly well and is very consistent.

Now I feel a bit more confident I can tackle all those difficult beans I might come across!

Does anybody else use an IR thermometer?

Cheers, Hugo

P.s. Here's how it looks like, to measure I bring it much closer, about 1cm. to get a more accurate reading. I figured if I always use the same measuring distance, I get consistancy.

I have been tempted to try what you have done for a long time and never did. When one attaches regular thermometers and thermocouples it is difficult to get them to read well because of heat transmission difficulty. Using the IR thermometer should alleviate this problem.

I'm glad to see more precision with the IR thermometer. But the advantage of a thermometer attached to the group is you can watch it and have your hands free, and I've had few problems keeping the probe end attached to my group. After awhile the aluminum tape can lose its stickiness but it tends to last months and is easy to replace at that time. I would love to see Robert try his idea of drilling a channel through the piston shaft and piston to insert a probe. But not everyone has a lathe at home.

I did the same thing a few months ago before getting the Strega. Purchased a Fluke infrared thermometer and put black tape all over the machine, mostly for my own satisfaction. It worked but I grew tired of all the"fiddling" around and just decided to mount a thermometer permanently on the grouphead. Again, that was about the time I moved over to the Strega, and the La Pav Pro has more or less been sitting idle ever since. Having said that, I am getting the urge to start experimenting with it again, in preparation for taking it camping this summer.

It sounds like drilling a hole and attaching a little digital thermometer is the most elegant solution.. If anybody manages, I'd like to see some pictures
As far as accuracy and consistency goes, the IR is just fine, only thing is, it adds another step to my already cumbersome routine.
I'm looking forward to buy the ZPM Nocturn Espresso machine as soon as it goes 240v. That will be awesome, to have the oldest, most manual espresso machine in the world next to the newest robotic computer guided machine

Hugo:

If you add a group thermometer even in the way I have done it, both hands are free and you are able to observe the dial to pull a temperature controlled shot. It doesn't add anything other than doing some half pumps to bring the group to the exact temperature you want, and then you have consistently good espresso. Adjusting the dose and grind to get the mouthfeel and flavor intensity right for that coffee is part of the charm of making espresso, whether you are using a simple manual machine or a pump machine.

Hugo, I'm glad you moved ahead with the IR thermometer. I nixed it because of the published bad results with reflective surfaces. You figured out how to make it work. Before I buy into the IR solution, has anyone tried the following?

A Thermopen is an instant read, narrow area probe that only needs a second to rest on the surface of my LP Pro group head. Has anyone used one or something like it?

I don't like the idea of drilling a hole in my beautiful gold plated Pavoni, but I would be willing to aluminum tape a temperature probe to the grouphead. Can someone recommend a brand that would work accurately?

A PID would be my ultimate solution, but my electricians talent is limited. Has anyone tried an external PID device with a probe taped to the grouphead (or elsewhere) and the on/off control switch at the power outlet?

Right now, with the OE thermometer strip and a flashlight, I'm not comfortable with the varying colors of the strip. Thanks, Frank

Hi Frank:

Search the site and you'll see people describing PID projects for home levers, including La Pavoni. One of the earliest was HB team member Cannonfodder.

Also your search for La Pavoni Thermometry should bring up my thread where I easily attach a $10 Polder thermometer using aluminum tape. I have it on two machines and it works perfectly.

Thanks for the report, Gary. That Polder thermometer and tape is right in my budget. I do need to understand the PID possibilities for La Pavoni. The video I saw on youtube made it look like I needed a machine shop, an electrician, and a few hundred dollars to make it work. I'll look up the threads you suggested. Frank

I don't think PID is needed on a Pavoni. Monitoring group temperature is essential. If it's a Pavoni with a PSTAT, having it set about right will do what you need. Then you do half pumps to get the group temperature right where you want it. Having a steam gauge on top of the slghtglass helps get boiler heat about right with a PSTAT or without one (High/Low switch).