Here she is, inherited from the in-laws :



1. The steam shaft knob has a screw, rather than a pin, that is stripping the thread on the shaft. Is there a food/heat approved glue I could just set it with? Getting it unscrewed and the steam shaft out took forever with a hammer, driver, soaking in olive oil, vice grips... Parts searches online don't seem to yield up a replacement part for that.





2. What size/part is this boiler knob gasket? It's not in the pre-millennium kit I have (rather, there's an o-ring) so I'm hoping to find it at a hardware store.



3. Is there a way to date it with the number on the top of the group? What is it called? Pre-Millennium, I know, but the group screws into the tank directly, and the boiler knob is female-to-male, with a flat gasket. The group has the piston sleeve, rather than the older cylinder described by the good Dr.: http://www.francescoceccarelli.eu/La_Pa ... cement.htm



I searched all over this forum already, so please be kind if you have an existing thread to point out to me. Look forward to talking with you, and to having shiny finished photos for the LMWDP thread.

Hi Fran,

First, congratulations on your new machine. I have a very similar era Pavoni, and love it. I can't answer all your questions (I haven't yet taken my steam wand apart), but I can give you a bit of info. My understanding is that Pavoni's that have the group directly "welded" (for lack of a better word) to the boiler (no bolts) are pre-1973. Way pre-millennium...I think of mine as "vintage". The parts are difficult to come by (especially boiler elements, I think). Some parts are interchangeable with pre-millennium Pavonis, others are not.

In terms of the gasket that goes into the boiler cap...I got mine from Orphan Espresso (http://www.orphanespresso.com) a couple of years ago, but it wasn't labeled as a Pavoni gasket (it was listed under a machine called a Co-Fer, and these gaskets seem to have disappeared from the Orphan Espresso site during their streamlining/re-focusing on hand grinders). They may still have a couple lying around, if you ask. Doug (he and Barb run Orphan Espresso) has taken to calling machines of our ilk "vintage brass sleeve".

Doug and Barb are currently in Taiwan working on producing lots of Lido 2 hand grinders, so they have lots of emails piled up in their Orphan Espresso inbox...you might need to be patient. Francesco (whose site you linked to earlier) collects, repairs, and sells vintage levers from my understanding. He may be able to sell you that boiler cap gasket.

It might be a bit of a pain to get the machine up and running, but I've been very impressed with the performance of mine. I'd encourage you to put in the effort.

A couple of general links that helped me make better coffee with my Pavoni are:

Reaching the Zen Zone with a Two Switch La Pavoni

Adding Thermometry to a La Pavoni Europiccola


*I haven't come across too many others with these vintage Pavonis, but there are some on H-B here:

- Dr. Gary has what might be the FIRST North American Pavoni (a couple of years before ours, but similar)
- mborkow started a thread about one here: What have I won!? Vintage La Pavoni...
- rpavlis doesn't have a machine as old as ours, but has done some nice writing on how to get the most out of these machines.

See this thread for some more info: Learning on used La Pavoni Europiccola

Enjoy!

There is a serious problem concerning the use of the term "premillenium" with La Pavoni machines! In the first place they evolve constantly, and La Pavoni has a strange way of mixing parts for long periods after they change things. There are THREE very different groups. The first was manufactured from 1961 to 1973. This one probably was the best quality of manufacture of all.

The second was manufactured from 1974 to 2000. The group is heated by a steam channel that allows live steam to keep the top of the group at the boiler temperature.

The third has been manufactured after 2000. The group cylinder wall is made of polyphenylene sulphide, and early models have also pistons made of this polymer. In my opinion plastic is not fantastic. It is basically a plastic version of the 1961-1973 group in many ways.

The kit you have is for the 1974 to 2000 group.

Your machine has the 1961-1973 group. The steam control knob is held on by a screw, as it should be, rather than a junk roll pin.

If you have access to small machine shop equipment it is extremely easy to make many of the parts for La Pavoni machines, and often it is easier to make them much higher quality than stock. I have made steam knobs from solid brass (they get a bit warm, but not hot enough to burn fingers), and from wood with a brass core. Hard woods like ebony can be machined with metal working equipment.

Phasor wrote: .....listed under a machine called a Co-Fer...

Jamie,

omg!!!! http://www.francescoceccarelli.eu/La_Pa ... 60_eng.htm

"the pliers in the photo are used normally to tighten the metal clamps of the cages of rabbits." lol perfect. but also, the steam tap looks to be similar, and there are links to discuss procurement of gaskets. thanks for the pointer, i'll see what i can find out.

rpavlis wrote:
Your machine has the 1961-1973 group. The steam control knob is held on by a screw, as it should be, rather than a junk roll pin.

If you have access to small machine shop equipment it is extremely easy to make many of the parts for La Pavoni machines, and often it is easier to make them much higher quality than stock. I have made steam knobs from solid brass (they get a bit warm, but not hot enough to burn fingers), and from wood with a brass core. Hard woods like ebony can be machined with metal working equipment.

Robert,


Thanks VERY much for the breakdown on these models. Much clearer now.

I disagree that the roll pin would be a disadvantage. Did I misunderstand that? As you can see in my photos, the screw, moving backwards, strips the threads when trying to extract the siezed steam shaft/pin. It's pretty chewed up now from the work I had to do to get it out! I don't need a machine shop to make a new knob - the knob's fine. I would be interested in drilling a hole across and sticking a pin through the whole thing so next time it will TURN! That seems a little trickier than throwing some acceptable epoxy on it.

Using endangered wood species on home coffee makers is really shortsighted, but if I need to make a knob I'll consider other hardwoods.

well, duh. The gasket answer is out there. Oh well, I'm now the proud owner of yet another Harbor Freight tool

http://www.francescoceccarelli.eu/La_Pa ... po_eng.htm

Now to find one...somewhere. I did email OE.

Francesco's your best resource for these very vintage Europiccolas including parts. Orphan Espresso is not likely to answer a parts inquiry email as they're now mostly in the hand grinder business. If you don't see a part listed on one of their sites it will be hard to source from them. I've seen another U.S. company mentioned that specializes in repairing old La Pavoni machines. They're in Seattle, I believe. Maybe someone can point the Fran at them.

If you can fit a replacement screw for the steam shaft that would be a faithful restoration for a very nice vintage machine. Loctite food safe anti seize compound can keep it moving freely. There are thread lockers that could fasten things but they can start slipping and be hard to clean out. I would avoid hardware store o-rings for steam parts because the wrong type of rubber can melt on you. You can make a flat gasket pretty easily with leather punches and a sheet of thick viton rubber if A, gasket can't be found. Maybe Francesco will have more made soon. You can write to him and ask.

Okay. I'm going to correct myself. After taking a closer look at the stripped thread on the steam valve shaft itself, you could try a thread locker. Loctite makes several. You want one of the ones that's rated as removable with hand tools. Another perhaps easier option is to wrap the remaining threads with plumber's tape to create a snug enough fit it will hold and also be removable. This avoids any need for glue.

hdiddly wrote:1. The steam shaft knob has a screw, rather than a pin, that is stripping the thread on the shaft. Is there a food/heat approved glue I could just set it with? Getting it unscrewed and the steam shaft out took forever with a hammer, driver, soaking in olive oil, vice grips... Parts searches online don't seem to yield up a replacement part for that.

With a new, or at least a clean and lubricated washer it will be much easier to unscrew that shaft from the valve body. I think a small vice-grip pliers should do the job of those rabbit cage pliers nicely when removing the shaft if it does get too stuck to just use the knob for that. I don't think you need to have the knob fastened so securely to the shaft that you can really torque it hard. If you over-tighten these you end up damaging the seat (is just a tapered metal pin in a metal orifice) and it will end up with a nose drip at the end of the wand.

After cleaning the threads where the knob attaches to the shaft you might want to reassemble with teflon tape or with a thin layer of lubricant so as to make the knob easier to remove fom the shaft next time you need to replace the washer.

hdiddly wrote:Is there a way to date it with the number on the top of the group?

Francesco Ceccarelli, as usual, has the answer. His info would put your B6904 in 1970-1973. He refers to these as V 1.6.

Excellent. Thanks both for your thoughtful replies and the pointers on materials. I'll poke around the forums for the Seattle shop first. I googled the heck out of the web yesterday trying to find a high-temp foodsafe sealing washer gasket approximating ID 24mm x OD 40mm x thickness 3mm (?? or compressed from 4mm?). i was thinking about sticking some old chewing gum in there and calling it a day.