I pulled a shot earlier that was the best I've had so far from my europiccola. It was all chocolate up front, beautiful acidity as it developed, ultra smooth. So good in fact, I ground another dose just to weigh it, thinking that this was a really good dose for the pavoni.

I was surprised to find that my dose was 18 grams. It fit handily inside the basket, my reg barber tamper top edge was just above the top edge of the basket. When I saw it was 18 grams I was really surprised. My shot flowed really nicely, no channeling, and pulled to about an ounce, one pull all the way down.

So if my flow was good, my volume was ristretto, but fine, and the shot was balanced, then why am I so very far away from the common wisdom of 14-15 grams for a pavoni pull?

The coffee was roasted July 13, it was Stumptown Guatemala Santa Clara.

Thoughts?

I say dont argue with good results. Grind/tamp/temp/pressure in the right combination combined with a coffee that you like.

I think the 14gr thing is just a starting point for the LaPav size basket. Not set in stone.

So are you just filling the basket and striking it level, then tamping?

I distribute a little bit or just rap my knuckle against the side of the pf to get it to spread evenly. I let the resistance and flow rate determine how hard my pull is. I tamp fairly hard, but I'm a firm believer that tamp pressure doesn't matter whatsoever.

Quick aside, I believe this due to blind tasting a barely tamped and monster tamped shot on a Dalla Corte Pro brewed at the same time. I was told this lack of difference was due to progressive pre-infusion, which I now try to emulate with my Pavoni pull.

EDIT: Oh, and it's a timed dose from a vario. All the coffee makes it into the basket.

What basket are you using?

There's no way 18g would fit in a pre-millenium la pavoni double basket...15g is the most I can fit in mine and that's with dense light roasted beans. That's why you see 14g it's because that's all we can fit in the old La Pavoni double baskets.

Totally different story for millenium La Pavonis...53mm basket is quite a bit bigger than the old 49mm.

Plus some people use Elektra a leva baskets in old La Pavonis.

So there's at least 3 different kinds of double baskets people are using in their la pavoni europiccolas and pros...that's why you see so many different doses being posted.

it's the millennium but its a 51mm basket not a 53. I've tried to use lower doses but I've had a lot of trouble. In all my reading about the pavoni though, i've never seen anyone refer to an 18 gram dose. Maybe it was a perfect storm of light roast, oldish beans, and my crazy styles. Just thought we could talk pavoni dosing for a bit and to share my results because for a long time, I thought I was supposed to be dosing a lot lower due to what I had read

The most I've got into a pre-M basket is 16kg (wait - make that 'g'!), and then its was with huge tamp pressure and an obvious choke - (hmmm...saw that coming.)

Any comments on triple baskets for Pav's? It would have to go with a naked portafilter, but I'm guessing tamp and/or grind would have to be backed right off...

TheMuffinMan01 wrote:I was surprised to find that my dose was 18 grams. ... why am I so very far away from the common wisdom of 14-15 grams for a pavoni pull?

Based on the volume of a cylinder, a 58mm basket has almost 30% more volume than a 51mm basket of the same height. Your 18g dose in the 51mm Pavoni basket corresponds to a 23g dose in a 58mm basket. This is extreme updosing in a double basket.

Of course, you can (and should) dose to suit your preferences. But a 14g dose in the 51mm Pavoni basket corresponds to a more reasonable 18g dose in a 58mm basket.

On my La Pavoni, with a 49 mm basket, I usually use about 12.5 grams or so of coffee.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Ray

RapidCoffee wrote:Based on the volume of a cylinder, a 58mm basket has almost 30% more volume than a 51mm basket of the same height. Your 18g dose in the 51mm Pavoni basket corresponds to a 23g dose in a 58mm basket. This is extreme updosing in a double basket.

Of course, you can (and should) dose to suit your preferences. But a 14g dose in the 51mm Pavoni basket corresponds to a more reasonable 18g dose in a 58mm basket.

Puck depth-wise, you're right, but headspace- and brew ratio wise, the comparison isn't valid

And my shot tasted pretty similar to some 18g dose shots pulled commercially, so it doesn't taste like massive updosing.