kbuzbee wrote:Sure Simon, I was doing the same thing as you (but with the double basket). Malachi suggested I loosen the grind. I did (1/2 turn on my Zass) and way increased my tamp pressure. Now I lift the lever, listen for the water to enter the group, lower it a bit (maybe 2", no more), slowly raise it (a bit more water), lower it the same 2", raise it one more time (still nothing coming out) and lower it all the way.... I start getting coffee about 1/3 of the way down, it's almost all dense rich foam (crema).At this grind, without the added tamp pressure coffee would have started out during the initial preinfusion. Let me know how that works for you.

Ken

hello ken
ok.i just made a wonderfull espresso with the double basket.with the single basket,i didn't notice any change with this method.i filled the basket with 15 grams of coffee(for 2 cups).what is the quantity for 1 cup using the double basket? i tried it with about 7 grams but the result was a coffee without body.

simons1 wrote:.what is the quantity for 1 cup using the double basket?

Hi Simon, I don't weigh the coffee, I fill the basket til it's full over the top with loose coffee. Then I distribute it with the base of my thumb. At this point the coffee forms a slight "bowl" in the portafilter with the outside edge at the rim. Once I tamp it's maybe <1/4" below the rim and level. It took me a while to pick the right amount of coffee so experiment but I tend to error on the side of too little rather than too much. When I do, the pull is thin and sour. I can tell before I ever taste it.

Ken

Well, I have pulled several shots while starting my first pull on the second pump (step 4 in the above post) with less desirable results. Going back to the method outlined above seems to work dramatically better for some reason. I really do not know why. It must just pre-infuse better? Bottom line, I get repeatably better results over the standard pull I use in my Using the Olympia Cremina post or using the double pump Fillini like method. Beginning the first pull on the third pump seems to be the method that is working best for me.

Wanted to share my experience with La Pavoni Professional, used here for over year now - this one is with larger boiler and pressure meter, otherwise similar to Europiccola. It is true, that for good shot initial limited meeting of coffee with hot water does good. That way you have coffee warmed and ready for steady main shot, that is going to extract the juice, you are after. If you expect to have first full pull to do thing, it will not work that way, since initial meeting of coffee and water will waste part of time from the shot to heat coffee into ready state, where you'll get only by ending shot. While subsequent time to proceed with remaining additional action will end in coffee heated beyond desired point. Certainly, desired amount of coffee and proper grind (for me good grinder setting can differ for particular beans, too), plus tampering should all balance into such extractable unit, that would provide right mix of brew strength, correct resistance to pressure, while given exposure to certain amount of passing water. Lever resistance is one of things to be felt while judging success of shot made. You have it resisting, but still getting trough via applied effort.

I am sceptical about broken puck stuff, read here, though - essentially, unit is strong locked by PF, little place for any move is possible (disposed coffee is here always pressed solid, no break apart ever), and even if there would happened cracks, application of water under lever pressure over whole top surface of coffee portion would overweight theoretical possibility of water to drip trough crack or several). So, I ruled out any care about broken pucks quite early.

With my machine, it is known accumulated heat to be the bigger problem - you have to be careful when making subsequent shots (also, keeping at bay their timing), as things tend to stay way hotter, than on first processing. As suggested elsewhere, running cold water trough PF helps restore balance. Perhaps smaller boiler of Europiccola results in less suffering from that character. Otherwise, my beloved La Pavoni is making good partner and exactly controllable, I would dream any machine to be.

simons1 wrote:what is the quantity for 1 cup using the double basket? i tried it with about 7 grams but the result was a coffee without body.

Hi, Simon - I believe, you ultimately cannot use double basket for the amount of coffee, designed for one cup. Comparing holed bottom of baskets, you will notice they are of different size. This is crucial to play along proper resistance of tampered coffee, which is another important factor. You fill any basket full and slightly over before tampering, you get good free edge for locking, after tampered. If grind was properly fine, you get that resistance, you were after. Slight correction can be achieved by keeping to the rule of finer grind/harder tampering = lesser amount of coffee for the similar resistance.

Myself, I find single basket way more sensitive to the preparing (naturally, bigger bottom surface of double is more forgiving to fluctuations), however, it is single basked, that is used here for one person - it also helps build feel of proper preparation better, because of mentioned sensitivity.