I was pulling some single espressi this evening when it occurred to me that there is a crucial element with this machine and the time it takes for a pull to complete. I have elsewhere argued that one gets great shots from single pulls and single baskets as opposed to the accepted preference for double baskets and double pulls. I have noticed that on my Elektra if a grind is too fine or I tamp too hard the slow pull (maybe it should be called a push) moves more quickly if one goes to a second pull in the middle of a slow one. The total time for a double is often less than the single would have been because the second goes more quickly. In the midst of a too slow anticipated single pull I suddenly did a second lowering and release of the lever. The resultant shot was certainly better than what I would have had if I had waited longer for the single to complete. I conclude that time of push/pull is the more important factor on a spring-lever machine.

I am curious if other spring-lever users have had the same experience.

KS

I felt the same with my PV Export. My theory is that the second pull breaks the puck and that's why original choking shot starts to flow faster. I'm not sure if this is what happened but that's my guess. I still don't understand how the air gets in during second pull without breaking the puck.

Hello Karl and Slooowr6,

After weeks of pulling good, single-pull solos with my PV, I stumbled on some new methods. Early on I had convinced myself that a second pull invariably damaged the puck, so I had been sticking with single pulls. These, on the PV, however, tend to be very small volume, and almost syrup-like in texture. Basically, a small volume of water per gram of coffee. I'm not sure how it started, but I went to a much coarser grind than I'd been using, and started getting more volume. I discovered that I could take a second pull without damaging the puck with this coarser grind, and as long as it was tamped well I was still getting good crema. I then moved to the double basket and three or four pulls, and over the past two weeks I have been pulling some stellar doppios - 1.75-2 oz. nice crema, and good flavor. I basically stop pulling the instant I see blonding. I think the coarse grind/hard tamp/pull until blond technique works equally well with the single or double basket, but the double is far more forgiving. I've said it before and I'll say it again - there's just nowhere for any mistakes to hide in a solo espresso.

By the way, it's great to hear from another Export user. The Ponte Vecchios are severely underrated (or simply unknown), and happily underpriced!

PC

I got the PV after reading your post.
I was using a hand grinder when I first got the PV, the grind is not as consistent as my current grinder MACAP M4, I have less problem with crack in the puck. When I first switch to M4 the puck breaks like crazy when the grind is too fine. It usually goes like this, pull, release, nothing, couple drips after 20 sec and keeps driping, after 30 sec it's no where near 0.5 oz, second pull, release, it takes 3-5 sec for the lever to return to the top and blond watery stuff flows like there is little resistent. After playing with grind setting for a day and many lbs of coffee later. I got the grind setting to ~18 sec of a single pull. I use this as a base for my 1.75 pull so I end up with 1.5oz with ~28 sec of actual piston moving down time.
I thinks a coraser grind have enough gap to let air pass through for the second pull.

KarlSchneider wrote:In the midst of a too slow anticipated single pull I suddenly did a second lowering and release of the lever. The resultant shot was certainly better than what I would have had if I had waited longer for the single to complete. I conclude that time of push/pull is the more important factor on a spring-lever machine.

I am curious if other spring-lever users have had the same experience.

KS

Congratulations! You have independently re-discovered the 'Fellini Move' as discussed here some weeks ago ...

Actually, all sarcasm aside, I do believe that for this class (e.g. Elektra, PV, Bezzera) of spring-lever machine, a correctly executed 'double-pump' move can have some real benefits.

One procedure that I followed for years was to to a short 'bleed pull' through an empty PF/basket immediately after bleeding off the false pressure bubble in the boiler - on the theory that air/steam bubbles could also be present in the grouphead, and to further pre-heat the PF/basket before unlocking and constructing my shot.

I also believe that these machines have a pretty rapidly declining pressure profile as the spring releases, so by performing a 'double-pump' you are effectively purging the grouphead of any residual steam (it goes back into the boiler), and bringing the piston back down into its most effective pressure range.

Essentially, the shot now becomes a three-step process:

1) low-pressure pre-infusion with the lever held down, and water slowly entering the puck

2) Moderate-pressure infusion with the lever slowly rising, the puck flooding with water and expanding

3) Full-pressure extraction with the water flowing at the correct rate and temperature through the puck

As with all espresso techniques, timing, tactile feedback, and acute observation are critical to your success - I like to hold pre-infusion until the first drops have appeared, than gently (very gently, you don't want "to shock the coffee into submission") allow the lever to rise until the liquid emerging isn't just dark and viscous, but has a few crema bubbles - then briskly lower the lever, hold it down for a 3-count (one-thousand and one, one-thousand and two ...) to allow the water and puck to stabilize - and finally, release the lever, allowing the shot to complete.

One thing to watch for - especially with the rather limited dosages you enjoy - is that the shot can rapidly blonde towards the end of the pull. Keep a sharp watch, and be prepared to yank the glass immediately if you note any color change in the last third of the lever's stroke.

For giggles, you may want to consider trying this process with a full-sized basket - in which case I will also note that the 'mustaches' who taught me also recommended not placing the cup until pre-infusion was complete, as they considered it to be "too strong with the wrong flavors" - you may find that by throwing off the early and late portions of the shot that the sweetness, richness, and intensity you seek is present in full measure.

Cheers

Jim

Jim, peacecup and slooowr6,

I note with pleasure that our posts make the lever forum third in overall number of posts behind only Espresso Gear and The Bench.

Jim, while i can indeed follow you in your methods I have to note that I still for the moment prefer (as you indeed note) a single pull with a single basket. When right I still find these the ultimate. But that said, I find that if I "choke" my machine I can recover something by doing what is called the Fellini Pull. For me it is a second choice. I fully admit a far better second choice than any other I know. But still second to the "vrai des vrai." I can see how some may prefer the Fellini as their first choice but not me.

Chacun a son gout.

KS

KarlSchneider wrote:I note with pleasure that our posts make the lever forum third in overall number of posts behind only Espresso Gear and The Bench.

According to the poll last year and the number of views, Espresso Gear wins the popularity contest:



But this doesn't take into account the relatively newness of the Lever forum, which easily passed its siblings over the same period in number of views. Some blame Steve for the uptick in eBay prices for Cremina. It's only a matter of time before somebody engraves their tamper with their LMWDP number. I hope at least it's an HB tamper.

Dr Jim wrote:Congratulations! You have independently re-discovered the 'Fellini Move' as discussed here some weeks ago ...

Actually that's where it all started.

Essentially, the shot now becomes a three-step process:

1) low-pressure pre-infusion with the lever held down, and water slowly entering the puck

2) Moderate-pressure infusion with the lever slowly rising, the puck flooding with water and expanding

3) Full-pressure extraction with the water flowing at the correct rate and temperature through the puck

This is exactly I'm following now but I still does not understand how step 2) does not interrupt the puck. The group head is a seal chamber at this point (the piston lower and passed the water inlet), the only place for air to get in the chamber is through the puck when the lever is lower again. I keep scratching my head but I just don't get it......... Does not the air flow through the puck create chance for channeling?

BTW, I really like the lever machine. The espresso from it is different from the one I got from Barefoot and like the one from lever MUCH better!

Dan, where did you put that poll? As you may not have realized the LMWDP crew is so dedicated to this forum that we rarely look elsewhere...and why should we...as we need is right here in this excellent community.

srobinson wrote:Dan, where did you put that poll?

The homepage has regular polls; there's also an archive, including queries such as:



They are far from scientific though since anyone can vote once every 24 hours (based on IP address).