Differences between Sama and Ponte Vecchio baskets and Peppina +Zacconi ??
-
- Posts: 134
- Joined: 11 years ago
Well as some might have seen in my other thread
I need spare parts for many different espresso machines (in Europe)
i have bough two Sama export
the first is the rusty one
the only thing rusted is actually the once orange casing
the rest looks fine , and the lever woks smoothly
the second have seen (ab)use
it came with one double basket + one portafilter
before i had it on hand i did borrow a portafilter from a Zacconi Riviera
i read that they did use the same portafilter
well that is not quite the case ,
the Zacconi can take the Sama baskets
but the Zacconi baskets have dimples in them to fit a groove cut in the portafilter
the groove have two cuts so that you can insert the basket ,turn it a bit , and it wont fall out ,
all the rims are flat on the Zacconi and Sama and Peppina
on my Peppina the basket are the same as the Sama
i plan on making some portafilters for my Sama and my Peppinas
i need some baskets
i have been in contact with Francesco , he says the samas he has all use a basket with a rolled /rounded rim
On the Ponte vecchio home page all the baskets look like the newer rounded type
any idea where to get the flat type , since i have both the Sama and the Peppina right now , and both using the same type , i would prefer to stick to that type
That said
Did any try to use the Rolled /rounded type , in a portafilter for the flat type ??
they are all 45mm inside
i could live with the dimpled type , it could actually be a better idea , in a bottomless /naked portafilter
Close up photos of the different portafilters and baskets especially the edges would be nice
-
- Posts: 1302
- Joined: 12 years ago
I'm thinking the same thoughts lately. I want a naked portafilter on my sama, and it uses the flat top baskets. I'm actually using the basket out of a peppina because I like the fit better. I found a source for naked PV portafilters, but its the new type. I'd love to know if they're backwards compatible. I also would like to have a clipped in basket on my sama. I often end up flipping the basket, still loaded, into the knockbox. Maybe peacecup will chime in and tell us if we can use flat top and round top baskets in the same group, assuming we have the proper portafilters.
LMWDP #366
-
- Posts: 1302
- Joined: 12 years ago
By the way I know a lot of people would pay good money for peppina portafilters, especially bottomless ones.
LMWDP #366
- Bluecold
- Posts: 1774
- Joined: 16 years ago
I use a riviera double* basket with la peppina, i got it from oe. It's made from a thinner gauge steel than la peppina's oem single basket, and since my pf ears are a bit worn, I need to use a self-fabricated spacer shim. The basket has dimples, but I disliked them and hammered them out.
That said, I think it could be easier to fabricate a new group bell for La Peppina so that she can take a PV portafilter.
*I dislike the single/double designation as it only creates confusion.I'd prefer to use gram capacity designations.
That said, I think it could be easier to fabricate a new group bell for La Peppina so that she can take a PV portafilter.
*I dislike the single/double designation as it only creates confusion.I'd prefer to use gram capacity designations.
LMWDP #232
"Though I Fly Through the Valley of Death I Shall Fear No Evil For I am at 80,000 Feet and Climbing."
"Though I Fly Through the Valley of Death I Shall Fear No Evil For I am at 80,000 Feet and Climbing."
- yakster
- Supporter ♡
- Posts: 7340
- Joined: 15 years ago
I was lucky that my La Peppina came with two baskets, the double and single. Like Roeland, I ordered the Riviera Double shown in the upper left as a spare thinking I would like the dimples to hold the basket in the portafilter, but I ended up hammering them flat and keep this as a spare basket, which doesn't see much use.
The Riviera basket is thinner, but my La Peppina doesn't need a spacer.
If you're making portafilters for the La Peppina, I'd be interested to see one made bottomless with a handle, the La Peppina stock portafilter handle attaches to the spout so you can either have a handle or have a bottomless portafilter, but not both.
The Riviera basket is thinner, but my La Peppina doesn't need a spacer.
If you're making portafilters for the La Peppina, I'd be interested to see one made bottomless with a handle, the La Peppina stock portafilter handle attaches to the spout so you can either have a handle or have a bottomless portafilter, but not both.
-Chris
LMWDP # 272
LMWDP # 272
- peacecup
- Posts: 3649
- Joined: 19 years ago
The newer Ponte Vecchios have the rounded edge on the basket, and these fit in my Sama. Also, the PV portafilter ears are a little thicker than the old Sama PF ears.
The upshot is that you may be able to buy new PV baskets and PF and make them fit the Sama (at least that works for the two Samas I have). The Sama PF is a little loose on the PV group, though, and needs to be locked in tight or it leaks a little pressure.
The main thing to do is find one combination that works as soon as possible, cram it full of espresso, and pull a great shot.
PC
The upshot is that you may be able to buy new PV baskets and PF and make them fit the Sama (at least that works for the two Samas I have). The Sama PF is a little loose on the PV group, though, and needs to be locked in tight or it leaks a little pressure.
The main thing to do is find one combination that works as soon as possible, cram it full of espresso, and pull a great shot.
PC
LMWDP #049
Hand-ground, hand-pulled: "hands down.."
Hand-ground, hand-pulled: "hands down.."
-
- Posts: 1302
- Joined: 12 years ago
So as long as we have the round top baskets in PV filters its backward compatible? That's good news. Now if only I could find a source for bottomless PV filters in North America.
LMWDP #366
-
- Posts: 134
- Joined: 11 years ago
Yuk
i did just notice that the hole for the handle on the Peppine portafilter , i going right through into the spout
That means that espresso is entering that hole , hard to clean , i cut the bottom out of a Pavoni portafilter
and havent used the original sins
SOOOH much easier to clean
no matter what i did with the original , rinsing it under the water tap right after the shot
but still when you made a flush , out came at first brown water
the espresso is really sticking to it inside the spout/bottom part
so now i am for sure making a bottomles for the Peppina
BUT taking one for the espresso team , i will try to make it so that you can use the new type of Sama/ Ponte Vecchio baskets (if thats possible )
so here is a plea
does anybody here have a Peppina AND a new type of Sama/ Ponte Vecchio basket
does the new type of Sama/ Ponte Vecchio basket work straight as it is in the Peppina ??
or could they take some close up photos of a Peppina portafilter with the new type of Sama/ Ponte Vecchio basket inserted
would also like close up photos of the new type of Sama/ Ponte Vecchio basket and portafilter
ps does anybody know why the other thread i have , is so far behind ,, even some have posted in it newly ,, it didnt move when new posts was made ???
i did just notice that the hole for the handle on the Peppine portafilter , i going right through into the spout
That means that espresso is entering that hole , hard to clean , i cut the bottom out of a Pavoni portafilter
and havent used the original sins
SOOOH much easier to clean
no matter what i did with the original , rinsing it under the water tap right after the shot
but still when you made a flush , out came at first brown water
the espresso is really sticking to it inside the spout/bottom part
so now i am for sure making a bottomles for the Peppina
BUT taking one for the espresso team , i will try to make it so that you can use the new type of Sama/ Ponte Vecchio baskets (if thats possible )
so here is a plea
does anybody here have a Peppina AND a new type of Sama/ Ponte Vecchio basket
does the new type of Sama/ Ponte Vecchio basket work straight as it is in the Peppina ??
or could they take some close up photos of a Peppina portafilter with the new type of Sama/ Ponte Vecchio basket inserted
would also like close up photos of the new type of Sama/ Ponte Vecchio basket and portafilter
ps does anybody know why the other thread i have , is so far behind ,, even some have posted in it newly ,, it didnt move when new posts was made ???
- grog
- Posts: 1807
- Joined: 12 years ago
I have a Peppina as well as a Sama Export. All of
My Export baskets have the rolled rims and they won't lock into the Peppina group (they do fit in the portafilter), although the Peppina baskets work fine in the Export's portafilter. I've never replaced the Peppina's group gasket, so part of the issue may be that it is hard as a rock.
My Export baskets have the rolled rims and they won't lock into the Peppina group (they do fit in the portafilter), although the Peppina baskets work fine in the Export's portafilter. I've never replaced the Peppina's group gasket, so part of the issue may be that it is hard as a rock.
LMWDP #514
-
- Posts: 134
- Joined: 11 years ago
peacecup (or others as well)
could you plaese take some cose up photos of you portafilters
and if you (or others as well) make the same measures as i do in one of my photos Top of basket to lowest point on ears )
here you can se my portafilter without a basket
ist completely flat on top
and as you can see, here ,with a basket the , it only rises the highest point , with the thickness of the material of the basket
now if you did insert a basket with a rolled edge , the top point would rise much more
that would only mean that you didnt have to turn the portafilter as much as with a flat one
if the full with of the ears is inside the group , it wouldn't hurt
BUT
with my Sama the ears with a flat basket just fully enter the group = full bearing surface
Now if we take a look at a Pavoni basket and portafilter (it uses a rolled basket)
we can see that the top isnt flat ,,its a sharp(ly) edge
the edge enters the rounded top of the basket
so in this case the basket only rises the top point with the thickness of the material of the basket
so maybe the new type portafilters for the Sama and Ponte Vecchio baskets uses the sharp edge type
if so that would make sens , sins both a rolled and flat type basket would fit
both would only rise the highest point with the thickness of the material of the basket
now if i for my self should /would make a portafilter , the flat type would be easier to make
and i think i can get Zacconi type baskets (with dimples ) they use the flat type basket
this is the way i measure the distance from the ears lowest point ,to the basket highest point
remember to subtract what ever you use to lay across the basket/portafilter
i got mine to be= top of basket to lowest point on ear =8,78mm or 0,3466 inches
now without the basket 8,08mm or 0,3184 inches
the material of the basket was at the edge 0,69mm or, 0,02716 inches
so somewhere a 0,01mm(0,0003937inches) did sneak it self in
here is a picture of the grouphead
the sloped curt is rather loooong
this means that you can turn the portafilter so far that the ears are bearing on its full length/with with a basket , but even without , you will be able to turn it further , and the ears will still be full bearing
so if one make a portafilter , rather rather have the distance topof basket to lowest point on ear smaller that higher
Smaller = you just turn the portafilter a bit further
Higher = the full with/length of the ears are nut fully bearing
TOO small , and you can turn the portafilter so far that either there isnt anything pressing ,or only a part of the slope is bearing
could you plaese take some cose up photos of you portafilters
and if you (or others as well) make the same measures as i do in one of my photos Top of basket to lowest point on ears )
here you can se my portafilter without a basket
ist completely flat on top
and as you can see, here ,with a basket the , it only rises the highest point , with the thickness of the material of the basket
now if you did insert a basket with a rolled edge , the top point would rise much more
that would only mean that you didnt have to turn the portafilter as much as with a flat one
if the full with of the ears is inside the group , it wouldn't hurt
BUT
with my Sama the ears with a flat basket just fully enter the group = full bearing surface
Now if we take a look at a Pavoni basket and portafilter (it uses a rolled basket)
we can see that the top isnt flat ,,its a sharp(ly) edge
the edge enters the rounded top of the basket
so in this case the basket only rises the top point with the thickness of the material of the basket
so maybe the new type portafilters for the Sama and Ponte Vecchio baskets uses the sharp edge type
if so that would make sens , sins both a rolled and flat type basket would fit
both would only rise the highest point with the thickness of the material of the basket
now if i for my self should /would make a portafilter , the flat type would be easier to make
and i think i can get Zacconi type baskets (with dimples ) they use the flat type basket
this is the way i measure the distance from the ears lowest point ,to the basket highest point
remember to subtract what ever you use to lay across the basket/portafilter
i got mine to be= top of basket to lowest point on ear =8,78mm or 0,3466 inches
now without the basket 8,08mm or 0,3184 inches
the material of the basket was at the edge 0,69mm or, 0,02716 inches
so somewhere a 0,01mm(0,0003937inches) did sneak it self in
here is a picture of the grouphead
the sloped curt is rather loooong
this means that you can turn the portafilter so far that the ears are bearing on its full length/with with a basket , but even without , you will be able to turn it further , and the ears will still be full bearing
so if one make a portafilter , rather rather have the distance topof basket to lowest point on ear smaller that higher
Smaller = you just turn the portafilter a bit further
Higher = the full with/length of the ears are nut fully bearing
TOO small , and you can turn the portafilter so far that either there isnt anything pressing ,or only a part of the slope is bearing