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Cremina - leave water in the tank? Short term.

Postby SwingT on Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:39 pm

My current pattern is to use the Cremina on a couple of days per week.

So, should I refill after usage - or leave it till next usage?

I'm only talking about three to five days, so I'm not talking long term storage.

What do you guys think?

any particular pluses or minuses?
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Postby Heilmittellehre on Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:08 pm

I don't have a good scientific answer. I do have an aesthetic one. Would you drink a glass of water that was poured 3-5 days ago? I wouldn't but I'm not sure why.
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Postby iginfect on Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:03 pm

Brian, you wouldn't drink bottled water? It was "poured" weeks to months before it comes to you.
I have a Cremina I used for a decade and a half and would never worry about water staying in there if not used. I'd drink about 1-2 doubles/day. Same with my Silvia for about 5 years and I'm plumbed in.

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Postby rawman on Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:13 pm

I'll repeat what I've read here before. Leave the water as long as you typically would. Next time you use the machine, before you pull a shot, take a few ounces of water in a mug, let it cool and taste it. If it tastes funky then I wouldn't leave water in that long. If it tastes good then it's probably ok.

I have read some people are worried about brass boilers leaching metals into the water if left too long. I have no idea if this is real or made up. My Cremina has a stainless boiler so it's not a problem for me. I fill the boiler, use it for a few days and then empty the remaining water and refill. If the machine is sitting a while I empty and refill no matter how full it is. On the other hand, I use RO water, which is sitting in a crock water dispenser for days before actual use.
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Postby SwingT on Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:21 pm

Actually, the main thrust of my question is which would be best for the machine?

hadn't thought about tasting, but I'll give it a taste test now that it has been mentioned.

FWIW, I'm using water that is filtered thru a Big Berkey, that often sits for a while the stainless tank of the Berkey prior to use.

Not sure if my 87 Cremina tank is stainless or not.
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Postby Heilmittellehre on Wed Oct 21, 2009 4:04 pm

iginfect wrote:Brian, you wouldn't drink bottled water? I t was "poured" weeks to months before it comes to you.
I have a Cremina I used for a decade and a half and would never worry about water staying in there if not used. I'd drink about 1-2 doubles/day. Same with my Silvia for about 5 years and I'm plumbed in.

Marvin


I thought about that. The short answer is "no." The longer answer is that I don't think that the two are analogous. Water bottles have to meet FDA guidelines for food containers. I don't know if espresso machines do. Water is bottled under positive pressure, which is not the case either for a glass of water or an espresso machine.

Personally, I'd give the leftover water to a plant. I don't see any serious downside to using fresh water. At worst it might be a minor waste of time.
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Postby HB on Wed Oct 21, 2009 5:13 pm

SwingT wrote:Not sure if my 87 Cremina tank is stainless or not.

Doubtful.
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Postby orphanespresso on Thu Oct 22, 2009 12:14 am

Boiler is brass. From observation mineral deposits seem to accumulate most rapidly at the water/air interface on the surface of a part with evaporation taking place leaving the deposit, followed by the same event over and over at that area. Most Cremina boilers have some scale about half way up the inner surface evidence of when the seal failed and the machine sat for long enough to let the minerals build at that point. A machine just taken from use will have a light coating of mineral on the element and bottom plate, but not enough to impede function . It seems that the water has to dry out to really build up any appreciable scale. Think of your bathroom faucet.....if you have hard water the faucet will show a buildup of scale around the opening and possibly over the surface but I don't ever recall the pipe ever becoming plugged.
So from the standpoint of the machine, it would be worse in a way to empty it and let it dry on the inside over and over thus building up layers of scale (particularly if you also leave the cap off so it can dry out repeatedly). Especially if you use hard water in the boiler.
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Postby rawman on Thu Oct 22, 2009 1:47 am

Good points all, sorry I misunderstood the intent of your original question. My Cremina is a 2002 model so the boiler is stainless. Older ones are probably brass as everyone pointed out. Doug makes a good argument on why to keep it filled.

One more thing you should keep in mind. If you do refill after each use make darn sure that the pressure is out of the boiler before opening the cap. If not, ouch! I typically refill before use not after. Much safer that way.
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Postby SwingT on Thu Oct 22, 2009 1:47 am

Thanks

I'll top it off with water, and tighten the top - will be ready for the next time.
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