Giorgio Milos, Illy's Master Barista, changes his mind about US espresso

#1: Post by **another_jim** » August 4th, 2011, 11:13 am

Last year, Mr Milos ruffled our feathers by lecturing us on how we ruin espresso; this year he appears to have become somewhat of a convert.

#2: Post by **TrlstanC** » August 4th, 2011, 12:26 pm

Wow, it's definitely refreshing to see someone write about how they changed their mind about a controversial (at least to us) topic. And you really can't find fault with the historical facts he's injecting in to the conversation either.

#3: Post by **Randy G.** » August 4th, 2011, 12:49 pm

Can we conclude that Illy sales in the US dropped between the two statements?

August 4th, 2011, 1:16 pm

Maybe their sales dropped; but I don't see how there can be a connection. The big selling point of Illy and other Italian roasters is that they know real espresso, and we do not. Illy, in particular, is also ultra high-tech.

If I were their marketing director, I'd be saying that Ernesto Illy did all this 3rd wave craftsmanship stuff back in 40s and 50s. By now, Italian espresso has moved out of the alchemist's shop into the lab. So now an Illy Ipercapsule gets you just as good a shot as doing handstand on a Hydra, courtesy of superior Italian coffee science.

Of course, if you've spent all this time selling Italian refinement and sprezzatura, switching the story to saying it's all in the science may be a little abrupt.

#5: Post by **chang00** » August 4th, 2011, 1:47 pm

The SFChefs2011 has featured Illy/Mr Milos' program today. *Shamefully* I will be attending to see what is going on. It will be interesting to try the real Italian drink.

http://sfchefs2011.com/schedule/industr ... aficionado

#6: Post by **endlesscycles** » August 5th, 2011, 9:21 am

It's absurd to suggest we are following Illy's past when the world has never known coffee as good as we have today.

#7: Post by **peacecup** » August 5th, 2011, 9:36 am

Thanks for posting this Jim.

Preconceived biases on both sides (i.e. N.A. and Italy) aside, Milos seems to be writing from the heart to me. Creativity is a creative process, and is driven more or less by passion. I like this quote in particular:

But there is nothing like the real world for proof of concept and refinement. Using solely a barista's palate and skill, no matter how highly developed his or her palate, is like talking to yourself after a while.

For what it's worth, I just spent a week drinking cafe espresso on a trip to Bournemouth UK. I can say unequivocally that Illy espresso, prepared by an Italian with passion, was by far the best coffee I had.

PC

August 5th, 2011, 1:09 pm

peacecup wrote:For what it's worth, I just spent a week drinking cafe espresso on a trip to Bournemouth UK. I can say unequivocally that Illy espresso, prepared by an Italian with passion, was by far the best coffee I had.

There's a lot of towns here in the US where the best espresso is an Illy or Lavazza store if one exists. The top cafes clearly have them beat, but the chains like SBs, Peets, Caribou, etc, and most mom & pop cafes can't. I would think the same applies to the UK chains and mom & pops.

#9: Post by **Bob_McBob** » August 5th, 2011, 1:23 pm

The times they are a-changin'...

Illy recently started offering SO espresso in a limited form: Monoarabica

#10: Post by **chang00** » August 6th, 2011, 1:31 am

This is probably thread drift, but it is somewhat related to Giorgio Milos. Yesterday I attended illy's abridged course given by Giorgio Milos et al at St Francis in SF.

The course was well organized for the consumer. It started with introduction on coffee beans, growing, processing, blind tasting of water, blind tasting of arabica vs robusta, blind tasting of under- and over-extraction, grinding, different coffee preparations, and finally hands on experience with two NS Aurelias and four Mazzer Electronic Kony's.

The blind tasting sessions were particular interesting. Six unlabeled dilute solutions of bitter, sweet sour, salty, and neutral were presented and participants asked to identify them. Like wise were unlabeled coffee of under, over extraction, and arabica and robusta coffee. In attendance were instructors from culinary school, restauranteurs, baristas, and of course consumers. Many in the food business could not discern the difference. Of course I aced the blind tasting/smell with 100% accuracy.

I could empathize his frustration in his earlier writings about non-Italian espresso. If the average coffee bar operator could not tell the difference, imagine the product that is presented to the consumer.

There is likely a dearth of consumer coffee appreciation venues, where someone with more experience is willing to share and teach coffee in a systemic manner.

Giogio himself was very friendly and knowledgeable. I was able to play with the professional machines and adjust the grinders at will, not to mention making espresso under his supervision. No, he did not make fun nor criticize American espresso.

Although illy's beans may not be artisanal, I do appreciate its research, consistency, and packaging. I also find myself looking for illy beans if I am at a foreign country; at least I know, when properly prepared, it produces tasty drinks.

Overall, at about $20 for the experience to include instructions, coffee, and pastries, it was excellent introduction to espresso.