I moved about 9 months ago, and recently came across a local roaster (who shall remain nameless) about 10 minutes away! It's located in a downtown area right next to a Trader Joe's I frequent, so it couldn't have been a more promising setup.

Well unfortunately, my hopes were dashed right after I walked in. There were a few kids behind the counter, who were nice enough, but.....

1) Everything was roasted DARK. I don't think I saw a single roast there that wasn't shiny and dark to vienna/french roast. I guess when *$ tells everyone this is how coffee should be, and you're a small roaster you have to give'em what they want.

2) There was a large selection of flavored coffee, and I'm pretty sure they use the same container to weigh all their sales, because the two blends I took home smelled a bit like flavored coffee

3) No roast dates on anything, and they didn't indicate it on the bags. I didn't bother to ask the salesperson as this was all careening out of control anyway.

4) My wife and I got a free brewed coffee as part of our purchase! We both threw them away about two minutes down the street after we left. Not the worst thing we'd tasted, but not very good either. I get better from QuickChek when I'm in need.

Against my better judgement, I did leave with a pound of Decaf Moka-Java since I had no decaf in the house, and a half pound of their espresso blend. Pulled the espresso, and it was......OK. Nothing to write home about, too dark a roast as I said, probably like a starbucks shot. The decaf Moka-Java was pretty poor as drip - ashy and bitter. I regularly do much better at home roasting SM's Sumatepia Decaf blend.

Anyone else had their hopes similarly dashed?

All the time. If a roaster isn't really into espresso, they almost automatically assume an espresso roast is just coffee roasted super dark.

Ha, ha, it gets worse. I notice lot of roasters lately heard that new dark is light so they roast everything light. So light that one of them when I talked to him said he drops them out so he still hears couple of pops of first crack while coffee is cooling. And that is for espresso roast. Needless to say that coffee was terrible for espresso and I am not dark roast freak...

jfrescki wrote:Anyone else had their hopes similarly dashed?

Oh, yes, it happens frequently, especially when traveling. I'd say that this is a driver that has moved some to roast their own coffee, though nowadays good coffee can be ordered and shipped instead.

Reminds me of a recent search for fresh whole beans on a trip to Santa Fe. I did manage to find a local roaster. However, I didn't realize right away that everything was roasted in the style of CharBucks. I bought a half-pound of a Kenyan SO. When I saw the oversized greasy beans in the sack later, I couldn't bring myself to brewing it.

Luckily, I found some freshly delivered Kenyan whole beans at the Whole Foods. These were properly roasted, and actually had Kenyan SO flavor characteristics. Pretty decent coffee, actually, as I recall. Too bad it's hard to consistently find fresh beans at a Whole Foods.

tekomino wrote:said he drops them out so he still hears couple of pops of first crack while coffee is cooling.

Ugh, I'm not sure that's going to taste good no matter how you brew it. Seems like there's too many people "dabbling" in professional roasting.

Eastsideloco wrote: Too bad it's hard to consistently find fresh beans at a Whole Foods.

Yes, last time I tried Whole Foods, I had to decide between Gorilla roasters, which is a nice roaster out of Brooklyn, that had been on the shelf for two months, or store roasted espresso blend. I went with the store, and it was, again, too dark and just "OK". But I've had pretty good stuff from them on other occasions.

I received a bag of espresso whole bean from a client as payment for a very small job I did. I requested to receive the coffee in payment as I wanted to try their product. The beans were very dark and oily. Still brown in color, by roasted far darker than anything I have ever roasted for myself (on purpose, anyway). I pulled shots with about half of the pound I received, and unfortunately, the remainder went into the trash. I never got anything that even approached drinkable straight, and even in milk it had to be tolerated. The aroma of the opened bag was nearly enough to get me to trash them before beginning.

To paraphrase a quote from Animal House, "Roasting black, oily, and smelly is no way to go through life, son."

I think a large part of the problem is that there are so many business people who open coffee shops, and they are not knowledgeable in the ways of coffee. They hire people who sell themselves and then it is the employees who are creating the product. The owner watches trends, and like mentioned previously in the case of the *$$ "Blonde" roast, they hear some ad copy stating that light is the new way to go, and they jump right in with no more data nor knowledge than what the advertisement states. The roaster does what the boss tells them to do. And as the rank-and-file public will tell you, "How can these beans be for espresso? They are not at all dark and oily."

On the rare occasion I hit a coffee shop and run into that I will engage the PBTC and see where it goes. The destination is usually nowhere.

"I'll have an espresso. Double."
"Ya' want fries with that?"

tekomino wrote:Ha, ha, it gets worse. I notice lot of roasters lately heard that new dark is light so they roast everything light. So light that one of them when I talked to him said he drops them out so he still hears couple of pops of first crack while coffee is cooling. And that is for espresso roast. Needless to say that coffee was terrible for espresso and I am not dark roast freak...

jfrescki wrote:Ugh, I'm not sure that's going to taste good no matter how you brew it. Seems like there's too many people "dabbling" in professional roasting.

I'm going to have to disagree with you guys here. Inspired by posts of another_jim and others I've been doing roasts of some SOs lately just to this point for both brew and espresso, attempting to get similar results with espresso as I do with the brewed cup. Medium time in the drying phase, fast through the Maillard zone, and flattening the profile through first crack.

On the lever, with fine grind, small doses, medium to hot temps, 10 to 15 seconds of pre-infusion, and long pulls I've gotten pretty close to what I'm looking for.

For instance, this morning with Klatch's Gedeo Worka roasted as above, fine grind, 15.6 gram dose, 15 seconds of pre-infusion, 1 minute total shot time, and 22 grams out. A bit of acidity made it pop a little, then it was all blueberries and blackberries, with a touch of cocoa at the end. The best SO shot I've had. Ever.

I then tried the Gedeo Worka roasted til well after 1st crack subsided and that shot lost it's acidity and didn't have as much berry to it.

Granted, I don't roast all beans for espresso this way but it sure worked for this one and a few other recent beans I've had.

Greg, I am sure there are certain coffees pulled certain way which come out very good with light roast such as one I described. But, not every single coffee. This roaster in question which should stay nameless roasted every single one of the coffees he sells this way. And I tried all tricks to pull them right and they were still not good... And I do know what outstanding light roast tastes like.