tekomino wrote:Its all about what people are willing to pay for it, there is really not crazy or not. I have very nice Cremina that works great that I would let go for $2000. You'd make same espresso on it as you would on the new one for $3700 so you save $1700 to put against titan grinder. Let me know if you want it

If I were one of you "Cremina Crazy" folks I would take Tekomino up on his offer. (Personally I think he's bluffing )

Anyway, I agree with Tekomino and would phrase it this way.

What would you pay if you could get your ideal machine? One that met every want and need of your espresso life. Unfortunately this is probably a hypothetical question for many of us. But what would it be worth to you if it did exist and you could get it? Not the best compromise, but truly YOUR dream machine. Would $4K or more be crazy for THAT machine? Not "Cremina Crazy", but espresso crazy. How much would you pay for any espresso machine that met your heart's desire?.

Now we all have different wants and needs and different priorities even on those wants and needs we share. That's why choice of espresso machine is such a fraught decision for many of us. But FOR ME and MY WANTS AND NEEDS the Cremina is such a close match that it is worth the going price.

But the point is, one (sane) person who perceives it as an ideal machine may think it is truly worth $4K; someone else (equally sane) who may perceive it as a slight improvement over another machine might only be willing to pay slightly more $$ than what that perceived alternative machine is going for.

And one final thought. You all may have this backwards. Why not think of all those years you could purchase a Cremina for a few hundred dollars as a shot at a super bargain. Or the occasional low price as an opportunity based on a seller's lack of true knowledge of the market. Like Illy cups, poppery 1 poppers, cona siphons, vintage hand grinders, [add your favorite example here], you can hope, and maybe you'll be lucky enough to find somebody not knowledgeable enough to sell them for the going rate. Happy hunting.

I saw that a 1990 just sold for just over $700 on eBay.

ya I decided not to bid on that, and them went on vacation, else that would have been great. Unfortunately for that seller one had just ended the day before and went for about 1200, if I'm remembering correctly. There is one on there now with a seller who seems like he's about 7yrs old and only uses CAPS and exclamation points, so he's basically shouting constantly. He's posted a question that was stupid, but the answer was obviously posted to 'inform' the 'hammerers' (?) what it's worth. It's kind of embarrassing... I would never do business with him/her...

drgary wrote:let me ask, how many of you Cremina owners find yourselves having difficulties with your Cremina too? Or, how many have tried a Cremina, gotten frustrated with it and moved onto something else you find more satisfying?

Is the thing that makes the Cremina so compelling that it sits at the top of manual levers for user feedback -- the intuitive feel and sense of control when pulling a shot? If so, how distant are the other manual lever alternatives? Add: And does all of this distract from paying more attention to the quality in the cup?

Yes to most all your questions regarding quality and ease of use.
I've had mine over 5 years, and have no trouble (relatively, as i'm not exactly Mr Wizard) maintaining her. I've replaced sight glass, one of the more intrusive fixes and had no leftover pieces.
OE has been with me every step of the way, for which I publicly thank Doug and Barb.

The coffee is wonderful, the process is RELAXING, and the smaller shots enable me to pull more shots during the day, allowing me to step away from my music for a few minutes.

The Strega interests me, mainly for the ability to use some lighter roasts, as Jim Schulman explains in his awesome video tutorial/review.
The steaming on the Cremina works well, but I like the flexibility of the Strega wand there as well.

Still, the little JEWEL that resides in my kitchen is going NOWHERE right now.

DR G,
One of the BEST ever shots I pulled was on a La Pavoni Millenium Europiccola.
I may have stuck with her but was seduced by the "little jewel." The hype was substantial, but I habe NO complaints.
Take her apart and you see ehy so many are impressed with her solid construction and ease of servicing.
When I'm on my game (and the coffee is rockin')..the first being more problematic...the coffee is so complex, and those wonderful citrus elements often hidden in "comfort food" blends come to fore.

Not to be ignored is (IMO) pairing a lever, in this case the Cremina with the preferred grinder for YOUR taste preference.

In my case, the lovel KyM manual (conical burr) produces a shot a wee bit bright for my taste overall, or maybe just less of the baritone that I like.
Slightly less bright is my Preciso (with Esatto attachment)...also conical.
The Vario, flat burred and uncannily similar in taste profile to my former SJ, TO MY TASTER is the perfect partner, by showcasing that wee bit of the lower end of the coffee.

Again, this is my take, and as has been said, YMMV.

IMAWriter wrote:The Strega interests me, mainly for the ability to use some lighter roasts, as Jim Schulman explains in his awesome video tutorial/review.

This comes at certain expense and that is shot clarity. Cremina just pulls clearer tasting shots.

drgary wrote:Now I'll finally get to try not one but two Creminas at the leverfest we're having at my home on 2/11. San Francisco Bay Area 2011 Holiday Get Together I'm really looking forward to this and have dialed in my two Pavonis to have a basis for comparison.

The biggest "issue" you will have with Cremina just starting up is temperature management. But, if it has right range temp strip you can easily manage it and pull some amazing shots. The learning curve, at least for me, was long and steep, but completely worth it...

tek..
you said (referring to the Strega v Cremina.."This comes at certain expense and that is shot clarity. Cremina just pulls clearer tasting shots."

Just curious, as i don't hang here as much as I'd like to..miss my friends ...
Have you actually experienced time with the Strega?
I would have thought the shots would more resemble the clarity from an MCAL, but I'm in the dark here.