BPA - health danger from water tank of espresso machines?

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Postby Lyvyoo » Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:28 pm

Hello,

I read many articles about the danger of BPA (Bisphenol A) on hot plastic containers. Is not the same discussion like the aluminum boilers, because the Bisphenol A was officially prohibited for some food containers, like the baby bottle etc.

Is there any reason to worry about the plastic tanks of our espresso machines? The water tank always heats up, whether we use our HX/DB/SBDU. Or it's just my paranoia?

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Postby Possepat » Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:27 pm

+1

I've also wondered this!
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Postby rpavlis » Wed Nov 21, 2012 7:01 pm

There certainly are problems from filling the environment with oestrogen type compounds. There is hysteria about some things in the environment, but there is perhaps some reason to believe there needs to be more fear about the impact of these compounds.

Bisphenol-A carbonate is a very impact resistant clear material that can be used for bottles. Unfortunately it can hydrolyse and produce bisphenol-A. There is good reason simply NOT to use bisphenol-A food bottles as a matter of principle.

Epoxyresins derived from bisphenol-A are commonly used to line food containers. Much concern, probably justified, has been raised on this practice.

Many polymers are plasticised with dioctyl phthalate, this to is an oestrogen.

Some detergents are made from phenol alkylated with C9 alkene isomers. These too are oestrogens.

Certain foods contain oestrogenic compounds naturally. That does NOT mean that they are harmless either even though some people contend them to be healthful to everyone. Natural does NOT necessarily mean wholesome. Plants tend to be laced with toxic compounds for defence from hungry animals!

I would hope that coffee machine vendors would not use bisphenol-A derived polymers in their tanks, either bisphenol-A carbonate or bisphenol-A epoxy resins.

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Postby sweaner » Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:11 pm

Have there been any studies showing leaching of the chemical from a cold/warm container?
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Postby Lyvyoo » Thu Nov 22, 2012 5:05 am

http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/10/...MT20101014

I think that Canada and European Union have some solid reports from the research institutes.

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Postby iginfect » Thu Nov 22, 2012 7:28 am

The Reuters article is 2 years old. What has happened in Canada since? If banned, which I suppose not, what are the espresso machine manufacturers doing? Glad I'm plumbed in.

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Postby Possepat » Thu Nov 22, 2012 7:47 am

In Canada containers containing BPAs have been banned for usage in baby bottles and similar. Everything else is just basically "be informed and look out for your own health"... ie look for signage on products declaring them BPA free. Most all nalgene and similar reusable drinking containers sold here are now all BPA free anyway. I'm just going to use my reservoir until I get my machine plumbed with inline filtration.

That being said, it appears Health Canada is now revising their assessment on BPAs
check out the conclusion...
http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/fn-an/securit/packag-emball/bpa/bpa_hra-ers-2012-09-eng.php
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Postby rpavlis » Thu Nov 22, 2012 7:55 am

The problem with bisphenol-A carbonate polymer is not so much that it is leached from the material but that the polymer very slowly can undergo hydrolysis, which is much faster at higher temperatures. The linkages in can liners are supposed to be ether linkages which are not ordinarily subject to hydrolysis, the potential problem here is residual bisphenol-A left from manufacture.

Unlike some other contaminants that are oestrogens, bisphenol-A has very high activity, so only traces have the potential to cause harm.

The so called phyto oestrogens in (very) many plants do not ordinarily produce problems in humans (and as animal food) unless consumed in massive quantity, most of these compounds are relatively weak. I suspect some people are more subject to these compounds than others. Fad diets are NOT good!

A large fraction of containers used to contain liquids for drinking are made of polyethylene or polyethylene glycol terephthalate. Polyethylene is extremely chemically stable and insoluble. Polyethylene glycol terephthalate is fairly stable, and when it undergoes hydrolysis the products are considered not toxic at the tiny dosage that could be produced from this.

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Postby Lyvyoo » Thu Nov 22, 2012 10:46 am

To be safe, I will check for a custom inox water tank...

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Postby TomC » Thu Nov 22, 2012 7:48 pm

Quick show of hands, how many people know for certain what there reservoirs are made of?

It very well could be benign, food safe plastic. Certainly helps to be dilligent and check with the manufacturer, but it sounds like from this thread people are making assumptions that there reservoirs are leaching BPA.
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