Is this a desired espresso undertone?

Discuss roast levels and profiles for espresso, equipment for roasting coffee.
zany13
Posts: 38
Joined: 7 years ago

#1: Post by zany13 »

Hello,

I experimented home coffee roasted recently, and I get this blend from my local green bean seller. I don't know exactly the type of origin beans are used, but I know the base (50%) consists of Brazil Arabica beans. The beans are fairly cheap by weight as well, unlike some of their more premium blends which have beans from Yemen.

Anyhow, I usually roast this blend to the middle range of Vienna and French roast. I apologize for my lack of professionalism of labelling undertones, the espresso shot always has this strong "funky" wood taste/smell. It fairly earthy, grassy type of aftertaste. I don't know how to describe the experience, I don't know if this is a desired undertone!

The roasted beans themselves smells very aromatic with the similar characteristics as above.

What I noticed that is when I have tried to roast this to blend anything below full city, this wood taste is not apparent. The brew usually just taste more sour and flat. The shots pulled are always very visually appealing; good body and maximum crema.

Any roasters had this type of experience before?

Thank you.

thepilgrimsdream
Posts: 310
Joined: 10 years ago

#2: Post by thepilgrimsdream »

First of all, how are you roasting these? Do you have a profile you can post?

Brazil's can be a bit on the earthy/nutty side, but grassy usually means the bean is underdeveloped. Not a desireable flavor

Try increasing airflow or extending your total roast time a bit until the desired roast level.

If you post more info, we can be sure to help you better

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another_jim
Team HB
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Joined: 19 years ago

#3: Post by another_jim »

zany13 wrote: I get this blend from my local green bean seller. I don't know exactly the type of origin beans are used, but I know the base (50%) consists of Brazil Arabica beans. The beans are fairly cheap by weight ...

usually roast this blend to the middle range of Vienna and French roast ...

the espresso shot always has this strong "funky" wood taste/smell. It fairly earthy, grassy type of aftertaste ...

The roasted beans themselves smells very aromatic with the similar characteristics as above ...

when I have tried to roast this to blend anything below full city, this wood taste is not apparent. The brew usually just taste more sour and flat
An excellent description! The other 50% is almost certainly a budget Sumatra, probably past crop (last year's beans).

You have a future as a home roaster, providing you loosen your purse strings a bit. Try any of the green coffee vendors who sell over the web; their beans are fresh, and mostly a lot less earthy/woody/funky than a generic Sumatra/Brazil blend.
Jim Schulman

zany13 (original poster)
Posts: 38
Joined: 7 years ago

#4: Post by zany13 (original poster) »

thepilgrimsdream wrote:First of all, how are you roasting these? Do you have a profile you can post?

Brazil's can be a bit on the earthy/nutty side, but grassy usually means the bean is underdeveloped. Not a desireable flavor

Try increasing airflow or extending your total roast time a bit until the desired roast level.

If you post more info, we can be sure to help you better

Thanks for the response. I am using the Behmor 1600 plus. I am sorry about my roasting terminology, I got the roaster since Xmas and probably played around 6 roasts so far. All of them are using the automatic mode (1lb roasts), I press C (Rosetta Stone setting)before the warning that the machine will go into the cooling mode, and then try to hear for the beginning of 2nd crack then press the cool button, or + or - to extend the roast time before 2nd crack. I've made some variations for these elapse times before cool to give it different roast levels. I haven't gone into the manual mode yet. How do I increase air flow in the Behmor, open the lid a bit?

zany13 (original poster)
Posts: 38
Joined: 7 years ago

#5: Post by zany13 (original poster) »

another_jim wrote:An excellent description! The other 50% is almost certainly a budget Sumatra, probably past crop (last year's beans).

You have a future as a home roaster, providing you loosen your purse strings a bit. Try any of the green coffee vendors who sell over the web; their beans are fresh, and mostly a lot less earthy/woody/funky than a generic Sumatra/Brazil blend.
Thanks Jim for your humble words of encouragement!

I thought there is no shelf life to green beans if they are stored in dry and dark environments? I am going to try my luck with an online vendor for green beans next time.

One question, what do you recommend as a beginners roast that reflects traditional Italian espresso? Should I add robusta beans into the mix?

thepilgrimsdream
Posts: 310
Joined: 10 years ago

#6: Post by thepilgrimsdream »

zany13 wrote:Thanks for the response. I am using the Behmor 1600 plus. I am sorry about my roasting terminology, I got the roaster since Xmas and probably played around 6 roasts so far. All of them are using the automatic mode (1lb roasts), I press C (Rosetta Stone setting)before the warning that the machine will go into the cooling mode, and then try to hear for the beginning of 2nd crack then press the cool button, or + or - to extend the roast time before 2nd crack. I've made some variations for these elapse times before cool to give it different roast levels. I haven't gone into the manual mode yet. How do I increase air flow in the Behmor, open the lid a bit?
Not really sure how the Behmor works, but extending the roast time or development time should do away with the grassy flavor.

Sweet Maria's is a great resource for fresh quality greens. I would buy a few pounds of something to see if it's you or the coffee.

How long is your roast? At how many minutes do you hit first crack?

zany13 (original poster)
Posts: 38
Joined: 7 years ago

#7: Post by zany13 (original poster) »

18-20 minutes maybe? Like I said before, I am still new to the machine too, so I didn't really record the times exactly. Once I hear constant cracking, I press the C button and that prolongs the roasting anywhere from 3 - 5 min (I think).

I am roasting in my kitchen, I place the roaster on a baking pan on the stove top, so the range hood can get rid of the smoke.

Yeah I will try another green bean vendor for sure. I have been using this current one for the past 3 years. I used to roast with an air popcorn popper. The results were not as consistent as using the Behmor.

Charlene
Posts: 494
Joined: 7 years ago

#8: Post by Charlene replying to zany13 »

I've been roasting with a Behmor for 6 years setting it up on the stove under the vent-a-hood. Works well.

Robusta coffee beans are mostly avoided by coffee purists and I'm of the same opinion.

You really can not go wrong with buying beans from Sweet Maria's and have bought them for over 10 years.

Also of note, after roasting even good beans, they need to have about three days of rest prior to brewing with them, otherwise that grassy taste is likely to result.

When using the Behmor for a 1 pound batch, I use the following settings...

1st: Batch size: 1
2nd: Profiles: P5
3rd: Programs: D
(edited to correct the order of occurrence)

And, increase the roast time setting using the '+' button to push the time to the max of 25min 30 sec.

When the roast is about 6 minutes away from timeout, I switch to manual mode to bring the temp up in increments close to a 300 reading as observed using the 'B' button. The reading is not in Fahrenheit or Celsius, rather it is simply a logic number monitored by the controller.
It it exceeds 320 there will be trouble... that is too hot and a automatic shut down is eminent to prevent a fire.

The Behmor can also be preheated prior to loading the beans. That helps and it reduces the roast time to first crack.

I use the 'C' button to extend roast time as you do to achieve the desired roast level.

zany13 (original poster)
Posts: 38
Joined: 7 years ago

#9: Post by zany13 (original poster) »

Thanks Charlene for the detailed profile description! I have a vent a hood as well lol.

I think the 1600 plus has different buttons.

As I recall, I press the 1lb button, then P1, and start.

I think the time of 18:30 appears on the counter, and I usually press "+" till it goes up to 21:00 (the max time allowed).

Yeah at around 7 min mark the machine will go into safe mode, and I missed it once :roll: I had to restart the roast and that batch was like charcoal hahahha.

I've just started using the A, and B buttons during roast to see the temperatures of the exhaust port and interior temp.

Its a fun machine to use, just learning the manual settings will take some time.

yeah I am also trying to switch bean providers to see if its the beans that is giving off that "funk" or my roasting methods.

I'll keep you all updated with my progress :)

Charlene
Posts: 494
Joined: 7 years ago

#10: Post by Charlene replying to zany13 »

I installed the plus upgrade on my Behmor so you and I have the same buttons.

If you use the procedure I outlined it will show 25 min. 30 seconds. Promise!

I checked the button pushing list I previously posted and found I had last two in reverse order. I edited that list to fix that.

1st: Batch size: 1
2nd: Profiles: P5
3rd: Programs: D
(edited to correct the order of occurrence)

The order in which you press the buttons is important.

Safe mode start is temp based, not time based. I learned this through experience.
I set a timer to go off 15 minutes from start as I have described to alert me to watch the roaster to reset the safety timeout which is generally at about 8 to 9 minutes before the roast times out. If you fool around with manual mode and get the temp up higher than the auto mode does, it can kick in sooner than that.

Absolutely, avail Sweet Maria's for green SO beans. That is the best advice I could give anyone on buying greens.
They are a top notch outfit and shipments are typically same work day as the order is received. They don't screw around.

Always happy to help others on the Behmor path... so yes, keep us posted!

What a wonderful Christmas gift to receive a bean roaster. Somebody cares about you!

I am mentally ready to take roasting to the next level now... looking to spend a couple thousand for the next roaster including the accessories to go with it. It's like when we got started sailing. First a 22 foot daysailer. Then a 25 foot sailing pocket cruiser. Then a 32 footer full bore cruising yacht with inboard diesel engine & all the amenities and gadgets like radar, fully galley with gimbaled stove/oven, refrigerator/freezer, running hot and cold water, head with hot shower.

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