Are you cupping your roasts?

Discuss roast levels and profiles for espresso, equipment for roasting coffee.
Purista
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#1: Post by Purista »

We have been cupping our roasts, but my wife's palate seems to be much more developed than mine, so I'm not sure I am going about it correctly.

Should we be looking to rate them by number using a form similar to that found in the book Home Coffee Roasting: Romance & Revival or such as that found on Sweet Maria's, or should we be noting Aroma, Acidity, Body, Mouthfeel, and Finish using descriptive words such as 'melon', 'hazelnut', etc.?
David + Mae
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Boldjava
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#2: Post by Boldjava »

All of the above.

Here is the way I tackle them. Suggestive only, not prescriptive. Develop something that works for you. I enjoy archiving and referring back to them, particularly when I purchase same farm, year to year:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Jz7 ... sp=sharing
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yakster
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#3: Post by yakster »

Also, when cupping, there's an order to the evaluation based on temperature so that you get the most out of your evaluation. While the coffee is still hot, evaluate the wet aroma first, when the coffee is in a normal 140 - 160°F range evaluate flavors, aftertaste, acidity, body, and balance, and save the evaluation of the sweetness, uniformity, and clean cup for when the cup has cooled below 100°F where you can really taste this. I cribbed this information from the Coffee Cupper's Handbook and other sources and re-jiggered the cupping form to color code the temperature ranges as a self-reminder. Hopefully you can access the spreadsheet here:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jc741zi9hh0uk ... 20Form.xls
-Chris

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Burner0000
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#4: Post by Burner0000 »

I'm gonna side with Bold Java. Just do what works for you. There is no wrong answer when cupping coffee. Say your cupping a an Ethiopian Harrar known for it's blueberry aroma and taste one cupper may say blueberry others may say fruity or berry. There's really no wrong answer. I personally cup myself first then see how on target I was with what the supplier provided. I also try to stick to the SCAA Coffee tasters flavor wheel unless a particular taste really pops out at me.

http://www.scaa.org/?page=resources&d=scaa-flavor-wheel
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TomC
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#5: Post by TomC »

This will be a very unpopular opinion, but I stand by it..

I think cupping as a technique holds less value to the end consumer than just preparing your coffee that you roasted in the same manner in which you plan on consuming it, especially since, that's the way you're going to be enjoying your coffee. It's not a popular notion, but there's little sense in cupping, just so we can feel like one of the big boys in the coffee world, because "they're doing it too". I think nearly every single home roaster, or coffee enthusiast at home (including myself once) gets into cupping, because it seems cool when we hear about it. Every time I'd cup a roast, I end up pouring off the liquid into another vessel and do my best to filter off much of the fines and particulates in the brew that will skew the body/mouthfeel assessment. It takes more time and is messier than just making a quick press pot brew or Clever drip, etc.

And on a small sample roaster like the Quest it's nearly pointless. It will tell you less than what just preparing a simple small brew will, which will take either the same amount of time, or likely less, when you factor in the clean up time from a cupping session. The only time something like cupping would be of much benefit to me is after getting into roast profiling on a much larger roaster where large enough samples can be quickly pulled, lined up and assessed for roast development. Then I can go back, note that time of post 1C development and copy the profile again.

They have to cup (importers and buyers) because they have to assess massive amounts of coffees in a reasonable amount of time and decide wether or not to buy it. For the end user, that decision has already been made. So cupping has nothing to do for us deciding on the qualities of the coffee. At this point, all we can assess is whether we like the roast profile we put it thru.
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Boldjava
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#6: Post by Boldjava »

Burner0000 wrote:...I also try to stick to the SCAA Coffee tasters flavor wheel unless a particular taste really pops out at me.

http://www.scaa.org/?page=resources&d=scaa-flavor-wheel
My problem with using the flavor wheel is that folks pay attention to the words on the wheel and will "force-fit" rather than finding words for what they are experiencing. They will see "clove" i.e., and feel compelled to use some word that is on the wheel. It becomes limiting/intrusive/restrictive whenever I have ever trotted it out at our tables. Look at it and then put it away. YMMV.

I call what I taste. Our Gopher cuppers howled when I trotted "celery" out. It was a delicious celery and I kept it in the notes since it was in the cup for me <grins>. No swaying me...
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Boldjava
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#7: Post by Boldjava »

TomC wrote:This will be a very unpopular opinion, but I stand by it..

I think cupping as a technique holds less value to the end consumer than just preparing your coffee that you roasted in the same manner in which you plan on consuming it. It's not a popular notion, but there's little sense in cupping, just so we can feel like one of the big boys in the coffee world, because "they're doing it too". ...
Note: I don't cup. I evaluate, prepping the cup as a KONE pourver or vacpot at day 3-5. I personally find that evaluating a cup helps me pay attention, to really focus on a coffee. A friend who has an excellent palate will often say, "OK, this is an 86.75. What is it missing that would make it an 87.5?"

I think that is an excellent practice/discipline.
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TomC
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#8: Post by TomC »

I agree with everything you've written here so far. My point was the SCAA cupping protocols do best for folks deciding to buy large quantities of various coffees. I think a critical eye (and palate) should be trained on the coffees we enjoy. For me, it's a good portion of the enjoyment I get out of the coffee. I just don't need to drag out a half dozen cupping bowls and make loud slurping noises in order to do so.
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MSH
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#9: Post by MSH »

+1 on everything Tom stated. I prefer to evaluate my roasts the way I drink it everyday (these days nearly 100% V60). The one exception is the HB roast competition the last two years and that is only because SM evaluates the coffees for the comp in this fashion. Personally I find cupping painful but maybe that's because I've never taken in interest in cupping on a regular basis

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yakster
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#10: Post by yakster »

I don't perform a full cupping very often, usually only when I'm comparing different coffees or roasts. It's a skill that I'd like to develop to help improve my vocabulary and in the event that I step up to become a distributor of coffee in the buying club for the coffees stored in the west coast warehouses.

I still think that a lot of the concepts covered in cupping carry over into just evaluating coffee with your favorite brew method... thinking about the coffee and continuing to evaluate it as it cools. The slurping isn't strictly necessary, but it does manage to spray the palate with coffee to make tasting and smelling easier. It can also help prevent getting overloaded with caffeine if your sampling many coffees. I've heard you can imitate a swallowing movement to help pump the coffee aroma into your retro-nasal passages or sniff your coffee to force the aromas through the olfactory region, since normal breathing bypasses the olfactory region, greatly reducing your ability to enjoy and evaluate the aromas.
-Chris

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