malachi wrote:Using one in a cafe environment would be basically impossible unless the volume was VERY low.

Hi guys! Your thinking about the M3 being slow is behind the times. We have several high volume shops using our M3 grinders and a Press that can work at very high speed. It is their preferred equipment even replacing a Robur used with our Press.

We haven't timed that shop but they handle some serious traffic. We do know that to do two shots every 70 - 76 seconds isn't hard. That's 35-38 seconds a shot with a 30 second pour time. All explained on our Coffeeshop page as referenced above. During the movie shown on that page the young lady barista casually does 4 1/2 shots in under three minutes. Not working very hard either.

We at Versalab are seriously perturbed that Jim Schulman should continue to blacken the reputation of our equipment.

We have a great many grinders in the field all running nicely. Go to the website and read the customer testimonials please.

We have grinders doing hard service in coffee shops running thousands of pounds of beans without any problems.

And the technical statements that were listed are quite incorrect.

-- Drive belts do not have to be of the "cogged" or "timing" type in order to perform in this environment.

-- The shaft of the grinder is held quite rigidly in a pair of ball bearings. A perfectly trouble free arrangement that had problems only in the first few grinders. [Mr.Schulman's grinder is serial number 9.] We made a rather tiny change (.010") and all has been quite perfect since.

-- No key is necessary between the pulley and the shaft.

-- The adjustment lock knob in Mr. Schulman's grinder was installed by him. It was a free kit that made the grind extremely repeatable. If he had a confusion or difficulty in installation he did not call regarding it.

What makes the matter worse for us is that 23 months ago Mr. Schulman was given the opportunity to ship the grinder back to us at our expense to be completely updated free of charge. He thanked us for our kind offer. But it's an opportunity he has never used despite several reminders. Yet he continues to post negative and erroneous comments about the grinder.

lauradearborn wrote:During the movie shown on that page the young lady barista casually does 4 1/2 shots in under three minutes. Not working very hard either.

In the spirit of full disclosure, she's also using two grinders and they appear to hum for ~20 seconds per double, which is rather slow by Mazzer commercial standards, to name only one manufacturer. To fairly compare apples to apples, what is the duty rating of the grinder depicted in the video (i.e., seconds per 14 gram double, does it allow continuous duty or are rests required)?

Over time, the brass adjustment section of my M3 has become more and more difficult to turn, now, it won't budge. I'm reluctant to use a penetrating oil because it's not food grade and a pipe wrench with a rubber protector seems a little over the top. Am I the first M3 owner to experience this?

I agree with Jim on the slipping issues. My M3 has all the latest updates but still slips and chews up belts if I attempt grinding a light roast. Other than that I have had no problems since the updates. If the belt/pulley were cogged I think it would fix the issue with lighter roasts. Note that only two 17g doubles get ground per day on my M3. I shudder to think what might happen if I used it more than I do.

Fullsack wrote:Over time, the brass adjustment section of my M3 has become more and more difficult to turn, now, it won't budge. I'm reluctant to use a penetrating oil because it's not food grade and a pipe wrench with a rubber protector seems a little over the top. Am I the first M3 owner to experience this?

I have had this problem as well but coating the threads with some food grade grease fixed the problem for me.

Does anyone else feel like "that person" just walked into the local bar where you and your buddies are always hanging out? It kinda feels like an invasion when Versalab comes in here like that. I mean, who am I gonna trust, Jim Schulman or Versalab? Oh well. Still wish I could have got an M3, but just from a company that understood business.

Heck, ECCO cafe just sent me a pound of La Maravila (vacpot roast) because I've been patiently waiting (and impatiently emailing them) about when their SO La Maravila to become available. Now that's a company that makes me want to do business with them!

Laura: It's not about the facts anymore, because they've been so muddied and lost in all the accusations and rumor. That's why I glossed over the stuff I quoted below. It's about the impression I have of Versalab. It's about responsibility and marketing. But even more so, it's about going above and beyond - not getting caught in this "he said, she said" stuff, but it being explicitly clear that Versalab always has and always will act with integrity and take care of the customer. It's about doing the right thing, even when the customer isn't. I don't want to buy expensive espresso equipment from a used car salesman.

lauradearborn wrote:We at Versalab are seriously perturbed that Jim Schulman should continue to blacken the reputation of our equipment.

We have a great many grinders in the field all running nicely. Go to the website and read the customer testimonials please.

We have grinders doing hard service in coffee shops running thousands of pounds of beans without any problems.

And the technical statements that were listed are quite incorrect.

-- Drive belts do not have to be of the "cogged" or "timing" type in order to perform in this environment.

-- The shaft of the grinder is held quite rigidly in a pair of ball bearings. A perfectly trouble free arrangement that had problems only in the first few grinders. [Mr.Schulman's grinder is serial number 9.] We made a rather tiny change (.010") and all has been quite perfect since.

-- No key is necessary between the pulley and the shaft.

-- The adjustment lock knob in Mr. Schulman's grinder was installed by him. It was a free kit that made the grind extremely repeatable. If he had a confusion or difficulty in installation he did not call regarding it.

What makes the matter worse for us is that 23 months ago Mr. Schulman was given the opportunity to ship the grinder back to us at our expense to be completely updated free of charge. He thanked us for our kind offer. But it's an opportunity he has never used despite several reminders. Yet he continues to post negative and erroneous comments about the grinder.

Long-time members may recognize this discussion as the familiar he said/she said loop of vendor service complaints documented in the Guidelines for productive online discussion (specifically steps 1 through 5). Unless someone has a new point to offer, please, let's move on. Thanks.