another_jim wrote:If you think I have the vaguest clue at this point what grinder has been where; you're overestimating my attention span.

The Jolly produces sweet, bass heavy seductive shots when it's "on." I think all the reviewers agree on that. However, I don't think it's all that consistently on. I don't think it's as consistent as the Max, and it isn't even close to any of the conicals for reproducing the same taste time after time. However, Dan has the opposite opinion on the Jolly and Max; and the other reviewers think its consistency is in the same ballpark as the conicals, and, by inference, greater than the Max's. If you say nobody else has seen the Max, I'm sure that's right.

It could be that the Duranium burrs are changing the grinder's properties, and I'm going to get to do this all over. Oh goodie

someone has to keep you honest

ken

I had the Super Jolly and Kony, my preference was for the Super Jolly or my Cimbali Jr over the Kony. I do not remember the Super Jolly being as touchy as you describe but I had the stock burr set.

another_jim wrote:The Jolly produces sweet, bass heavy seductive shots when it's "on." I think all the reviewers agree on that. However, I don't think it's all that consistently on. I don't think it's as consistent as the Max, and it isn't even close to any of the conicals for reproducing the same taste time after time. However, Dan has the opposite opinion on the Jolly and Max; and the other reviewers think its consistency is in the same ballpark as the conicals, and, by inference, greater than the Max's.

It could be that the Duranium burrs are changing the grinder's properties, and I'm going to get to do this all over. Oh goodie

There's been general agreement that the TGP conicals produce very consistent pours, and are generally less finicky about the grind setting than flat burr grinders. Ken and I both noted how easy it was to dial in the conicals (or hybrids). I see this as one of the most significant results to come out of our testing thus far: not that conicals are better than flat burr grinders, but make it easier to obtain a consistent extraction. IMHO this is of far greater significance in a commercial environment than at home... but I'm sure others will disagree.

I compared my own (modded) SJ to the MXK and Robur, not the brand new TGP test model with kryptonite burrs. My SJ has two-year-old standard burrs, but I'd still agree with Jim. The SJ is not as forgiving in pour consistency as the conicals that I tested. Nonetheless, I think it holds its own quite well in this august company. Given my preference for slightly updosed (16-18g) double cappuccinos, the SJ flavor profile works very well.

Although I did not care for the MXK as much as Jim or Dan, that could be a combination of personal taste and perhaps an extended break-in period for the grinder. For a straight espresso shot lover, downdosing as Ken advocates, in pursuit of individual flavor clarity rather than a smooth blend, the MXK might well be the grinder of choice.

The Jolly is a great grinder, and a big step up from the Mini. In terms of bang for the buck, this is the smart upgrade for anyone who can make the counter top room (can an extreme hopper-chop fit it under 18 inches?).

But I have to say, consistency is seductive. After my time with the conicals, it was disconcerting seeing a grinder as capable as the Jolly producing inconsistent pours and tastes. Doing the Lux, Pede, and my slip-sliding M3, I expected it; with this tank grinder, it was a bit of a surprise.

People are willing to pay $4500 for a GS3 in the pursuit of consistency. I have a very, very old news flash for them; it's the grinder, stupid. A commercial conical buys a lot more consistency for a lot less money. If this is the goal, it should be considered ahead of an upgrade to a dual boiler machine.

John, your point on lower doses is interesting. The Robur has been easier to beat at 16.5 than at 13.5; and a big flat burr grinder may be the way to go for higher doses. Both of the Jolly's shots were more intense at the high doses; and it could be that with more experience on the grinder, I would have produced the better shot both times rather than just once.

Jim, will you be getting your hands on the Kony? I'd be interested to see how you think it compares to the robur and the macap version of it.

I'll say nothing of what I think of it, lest I sway your opinion ;P

Cheers,

Luca

another_jim wrote:The Jolly is a great grinder, and a big step up from the Mini. In terms of bang for the buck, this is the smart upgrade for anyone who can make the counter top room (can an extreme hopper-chop fit it under 18 inches?).

Probably one conclusion of the Titan Project is the big difference between the Mazzer Mini and the Jolly. The Mini Electronics has the same burrs of the Jolly but the motor of the Mini Doser. So, what's the E consider, it's still equal to the Mini Doser?

luca wrote:Jim, will you be getting your hands on the Kony? I'd be interested to see how you think it compares to the robur and the macap version of it.

Jim should have the Kony now (due to be in Chicago this Friday). Jim's apartment has become a grinder mecca of sorts. I hope he takes a picture of the whole line up before they get split up... I've lost count on the number , about 10 or 12?!

luca wrote:Jim, will you be getting your hands on the Kony? I'd be interested to see how you think it compares to the robur and the macap version of it.

I'll say nothing of what I think of it, lest I sway your opinion ;P

Cheers,

Luca

It's on for tomorrow. Today is the Rocky. The "Beat the Robur" contest will have gone 12 grinders with that. Not surprisingly, I'm somewhat burned out on this, so unless someone sends something really interesting, that'll be it.

Jim,

Would you mind bringing one of those 70 pound, $2000 grinders when you come to my place in a couple of weeks?

Joel

another_jim wrote:Not surprisingly, I'm somewhat burned out on this, so unless someone sends something really interesting, that'll be it.

Not surprising at all. I wonder if anyone had a Mahlkonig K30 lying around? Would that be interesting?

Br,
Teme