So I'm a total 100% newbie. I know close to nothing about this, but I've been doing as much research as I can and I just received a profitec pro 500 to use with my pre-owned profitec T64. I've spent the last hour+ trying to dial in my grinder to get a drinkable shot and I haven't been able to succeed. I really did not expect it to be this hard to get a halfway drinkable shot, and the discouragement is getting to me so bad that I can't help but wonder if I should return this machine and go for something automatic. As much fun as the hobby of espresso seemed, it's no fun if you can't make it work.


Here's what been happening:

All of my shots, no matter what adjustments I make, have been watery and sour.
To start I chose a random setting on my grinder, filled the basket. Shot came out far too fast. I set it finer and went too fine, the shot took way too long to drip and I got almost nothing. So I took it coarser again, and got one shot within a decent time that smelled/tasted the most decent of them all, but still far too sour and watery. I continued to adjust finer since I read you don't want your shot to start until after 6 seconds (and they all up to this point were starting sooner)...I got it to start at 5 seconds but then the stream was so thin and again, still a watery mess. And after this I gave up because I thought if it wasn't flowing fast enough you are supposed to take it coarser, but at the same time it's showing me I need to take it finer so it doesn't start before 6 seconds??

I don't know what else to do. I feel like I'm getting nowhere, all my shots suck and I'm starting to get upset about going through so much coffee and having spent so much money for such discouraging results.


Any help?

What coffee are you using? How fresh is it? When was it roasted?

Here is a good thread detailing some tips on the Pro 500 there are probably more threads, try searching.

Profitec Pro 500 cooling flush stabilization

Starting with good coffee is imperative.

Hope this helps.

sweaner wrote:What coffee are you using? How fresh is it? When was it roasted?

I started out using an aprox. 3 week old decaf that I'd been saving for dialing in since I didn't want to waste my better expensive coffee...I realize this was probably a mistake...but after it didn't work I tried using the Lovejoy that was included with the clive order that I received yesterday with same results. That bag says roasted 6/13. Not very fresh, but does that affect sourness and wateriness?

I am starting to wonder if the machine being an HX is part of the problem? I took the temperature of some of my shots and the temperature was far too low. But the thing is, when reading about HX machines I was under the impression that you shouldn't have a problem pulling shots back to back. If you can't pull shots back to back, how are you supposed to dial in...make one attempt and then put your timer on and wait until you guess the machine is back to temperature?


I apologize if I'm coming across as negative here. I've tried a few more shots, went a little finer to again try to push back the shot start time to 6 seconds and once again nothing even came out. I'm about to start a return

are you using scales, you need to be weighing an appropriate dose to the nearest 0.1g and weighing out your espresso to the nearest gram , taking note of the time and then adjusting the grind based on how it tastes .

OP, as a fellow noobie I can give you the following 2 thoughts:

- some coffee brands are just citrusy like that, and light, which you may easily interpret as sour and thin. Try easier to work with blends like say Maromas Orphea. That will always be full, lots of crema, and no lemon taste. Very forgiving. Even if you just did Illy Dark you'll get a very standard very restaurant-like espresso. I totally respect and understand people here favoring fresh small roasters, but actually main stream Italian brands are easier to start with even when they are 3 months old... You know, my machine came with such typical fresh, small roaster highly reviewed coffee. I was unable to make a decent shot. Everything was watery and too lemony. I thought something was wrong and so I did Lavazza Super Crema next, and it was fine...

- Your grind size, unfortunately, is far from the only thing that can ruin or help your shot. What is the temperature of your water? What is your water source? How do you tamp? How do you distribute? How many grams of coffee do you put it? How many grams or oz liquid are you getting out? How many seconds total extraction time? How many bars of pressure is your machine showing? Did you test the pressure with a blind basket? Did you do a naked portafilter extraction so you can see wether you're getting channeling, spraying etc? For the coffee you're using, is there a recommendation from the maker regarding extraction? If not, e-mail them and ask what they recommend. Is your machine and equipment clean? Did you back flush? Remove the basket from the portafilter, can you see thru every hole? Is the bottom of the portafilter clean? Do you keep portafilter in the machine to heat it up? When you put in the grinds, is your portafilter clean and dry? And there are actually even more things to check...


good luck,

rilec wrote:I don't know what else to do. I feel like I'm getting nowhere, all my shots suck and I'm starting to get upset about going through so much coffee and having spent so much money for such discouraging results. Any help?

Have you watched the Newbie Introduction to Espresso series? The mechanics aren't difficult, but it helps a lot to have someone show you the ropes. Post a video of your routine, it should be easy to spot your trouble areas.

Hang in there and let us help you!

My suggestion is to take a long term view. I blew through probably 3 bags trying to dial in my hang grinder at the time.

Along with Dan's suggestion to post a video, think of this as a process. Write down your grams, to the .1, along with the time it takes to pull out the shot before it blondes. I tweaked my process to dial things in one change at a time. In a relatively few number of days you will be the master of your shot.

Don't get too hung up on too many variables all at once. Start with the grind. Get some fresh coffee and establish where too fine and too coarse are in your grinder. It's been discussed here many times but in a nutshell: Get a little scale with 0.1 gram increments. Put 14 grams ground as fine as your grinder will go into a double basket. Tamp firmly and pull a shot. At this point, nothing or nearly nothing should come out (i.e., choke the machine). If you do get coffee coming out, either the grinder is not set up right or the coffee is really stale. Bin the puck. Move to a slightly finer grind and do it again. Repeat until something comes out, however slowly. When it does, move a little finer and repeat, this time time the shot. Forget for the moment about preinfusion time, just time from when you start to pull until you get 28 to 30 grams of coffee out. When you achieve the proper output in 30-seconds, note the grinder setting. Keep going, going coarser each time until you achieve the proper output in 20-seconds, note the grinder setting. These two settings are your rough guide for a normal shot. Somewhere in between is where you want to be. The exact time depends on the coffee, how fresh it is and your tastes. But, the variance will be more-or-less in between the two noted settings. Don't even taste any of the above shots and don't worry about watery pucks, distributing with a needle or anything else. If you are attentive at this stage, and a little lucky, you'll probably not waste more than a half pound of coffee.

Now for the first real shot. Set the grinder in the middle and see if you can pull a decent 25-second shot. Let us know how it looks and tastes and we can take it from there to help you fine tune.