I'm new to my Vario (and my Classic). I'm trying to figure out what grind will work best for my Classic. I had a basic setting that was decent, without having much time to play and experiment I just left it as is. I had some free time tonight and started playing with grind sizes... I'm wondering if there is something wrong with my Vario. The difference between the finest of espresso grinds on the Vario vs. the coarsest French press setting are just about indistinguishable. I'm wondering if my Vario is not responding to my dial settings?

Can anyone shed some light on the difference in grinds from finest to coarsest? Or has anyone had issue with non-responsive dials?

This photo might not be very descriptive, but I'll at least try and show you the difference I get. French press/Coarse is on the left, espresso/Fine is on the right. To the touch and close inspection, they seem VERY similar.


The results, regardless of where I put the dials seems to be an 11 second double. The only variation seems to be my tamper. But I've gotten it quasi-consistent.

Thanks for any input!
brad

Something is definitely off. When sliding the micro adjust, it will be hard to see much difference, but the macro adjust should give you a much greater variance in size.

I'd try pulling the top burr out and replacing it. Just to make sure it's in there properly. Other than that, I'm not sure what to suggest, besides phoning Baratza. I've never seen this problem before.

The Vario can easily produce a seriously fine grind that would feel like a flour if not just downright powdered sugar, and needless to say choke the crap out of your machine so that you don't even get a drop in a minute. If your picture is showing the range of grind sizes your grinder can produce, it looks like you have a damaged/disengaged adjustment knob. You could play diagnosis for awhile if you want. For example, you might unplug the grinder, remove the hopper and the upper burr carrier and actuate the right (coarse/macro) lever and see if you get any movement on the bottom burr. You should be able to see some movement. I imagine there are some other things to try, and you may be able to fix this yourself. Someone here might be able to help you, but at this point I think your fastest bet would be to take Keith's advice and contact Baratza Customer Support about this via phone. If you do, please let us know how it goes.

And unless my Vario is broken as well.. Which I doubt it is, cuz it works fine.. The movement is not a lot. The first few times I didn't notice anything at all, moving the Macro cam up and down the full monty.

WITH THE GRINDER UNPLUGGED, rest your finget on the bottom burr and top burr, so you can feel the space between them, and move the Macro cam up and down. You should be able to feel the burrs moving closer/further apart.

My coarsest grind, is a tad finer then I would Ideally have it.. but it's pretty darn good. Ive calibrated to have it coarser, but it seems it's at its end. Doubtful, but maybe your grinders burr calibration needs to be adjusted. If so, Kyle will give you the directions. Its easy on the newer models.. Just turn the hex head bolt(its a small guy), check the grind, turn, check etc etc. When I had it set up so my espresso grind was the second finest Macro, and the 6'th coarsest Micro.. The absolute coarsest setting, when making Syphon, would be a 45sec contact time, with a 1:30drawdown. Dontknow if that helps you or not. Im guessing not.

[/streamofconciousness]

Here are 2 observations based on what ya'll have suggested.
1. One the finest macro and micro setting, I'm still pulling an 11 second double. Based on Shadowfax's "you don't even get a drop in a minute" I've got a problem.
2. Feeling for movement between the burrs, I feel nothing, I see nothing. Seems I have a malfunctioning grinder.

Considering I've only had this equipment ~3 weeks, maybe it never made any adjustments... only now that I've had some time to play with it am I noticing these small nuances.

Ok, so a call to Baratza is in order tomorrow... unless someone has any ideas on how to "engage" the switches?

Thanks for the quick input.

Ok, problems solved. I spent about 30 minutes on the phone with Kyle (from Baratza) and we hashed through a lot of stuff. Come to find out I had powder on the reference surface. As he explained, espresso powder even at a mere 250 microns added to the reference point of the burrs is going to make your 250 micron grind equal 500 microns. So I gave it a good cleaning as he explained with the Vario they prefer the use of Grindz instead of taking the thing apart. Before the cleaning we pulled 2 shots:
1. Macro all the way up, micro at the mid point - 5.5 seconds for 1 once
2. Macro and micro all the way up - 11 sec
Then the after-cleaning pull:
3. Marco all the way up, micro at the mid - 16 seconds.

So learn from my mistake. Don't take the grinder apart, or if you do.... clean the reference surfaces THOROUGHLY before reassembling.

Gotta go make a cappuccino before I have to get to work!! Thanks everyone, and thanks again Kyle!

Brad

PS - Man does Kyle know his machines, and couldn't be any nicer!!! I think he was actually expecting my call this morning based on this thread. Never have I seen a company so in touch with their clients.

Huh, paint me confused. Your shot timings are still a way from espresso timings, and it frankly sounds like you still have a problem. What coffee are you using, at what dose (how many grams)? You're using a Gaggia Classic, correct?

Are you getting a significant visual difference between the coarsest and finest settings of the grinder now? For reference, here's a sample of what that should look like:



That's the finest setting on my Vario, on the left (right sliders all the way up, left one about 2/3 of the way up), and the coarsest on the right (both sliders down). That left sample is so fine I would get hardly a drop out of my espresso machine, and it would be a pretty putrid drop...

shadowfax wrote:Your shot timings are still a way espresso timings, and it frankly sounds like you still have a problem. What coffee are you using, at what dose (how many grams)? You're using a Gaggia Classic, correct?

It's probably a difference of dose. It's also likely that your grinders are just calibrated differently. (Also consider, different machines, location, humidity, age of burrs, position of the moon, etc... )

Keith, that's possible, considering he still has a number of notches to go finer. The deciding factor is whether Brad is able to get a coarse french press grind to be very coarse as pictured above. If he can't get that, something is still very wrong.

Let me first clarify. Those timings are based on pulling a double shot through a double basket. I was using ~15 - 16 gram dose. So in my mind the last timing wasn't bad... double that 2 oz in 30-32 seconds.

But your photo is quite interesting. Let me grind up some more tonight and snap a better photo. I'll compare mine to yours as well. At first glance, your finest grind looks finer than mine and your coarsest is much more coarse. I'll also show you a test Kyle had me try, which is take the grinds in the palm of your hand and squeeze it.... espresso will clump like clay and French press grinds will fall like sand. I'll snap photos of that and share.

I agree perhaps I'm back in business with espresso but have no idea where I'm at for coarse grinds.

More tonight!