www.chriscoffee.com: quality & service, second to none

What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?

Discuss roast levels and profiles for espresso, equipment for roasting coffee.

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by Ken Fox on Sun Nov 25, 2007 2:17 am

Every time I begin a roast session, I head down to my basement where the greens are stored and have to decide what I'm going to roast. I try to keep a fairly large stash of green, since for me, the coffee is the least expensive part of this whole "home barista" thing, with the equipment and the value of my time being much more costly than what I spend on green beans in a year. I enjoy having choices and letting the whims of the moment dictate what I'm going to be drinking for the next while after a day of roasting.

Over the time I've been roasting, I've had some favorites and some duds . . . It struck me that I'm probably not alone, and that this forum could use a thread (possibly meriting a sticky) where people can write about their favorite and not-so-favorite coffees, the ones they're glad they bought and the ones they wish they hadn't, the ones they'll seek out in the next crop and the ones they'll avoid. It might even turn out that by posting one's experiences someone else here will give feedback that might enable someone to get better results out of coffee already given up for dead, or possibly confirm the worst.

Here are my recent candidates in these categories:

(1) In my "Most Satisfying" category, the hands-down winner is "Ethiopian Yirgacheffe Adado Coop," purchased from both Miguel at Paradise Roasters and from Klatch Coffee Roasters. I believe this is ultimately from the identical source. This coffee, roasted to the onset of 2nd crack or a bit lighter, has never failed to produce an interesting, multidimensional cup. It was not exactly cheap, but not exactly expensive, either. I still have about 20 lbs of it left and continue to enjoy the results I'm getting from it, more than 6 months after the first batch of green that I received.

(2) My Best Value Coffees are a tie, which is convenient because I've been serving them as a 75%-25% blend, as suggested originally to me by Jim Schulman. They are Yemen Ismaili and Aged Sumatra Lintong, both purchased from the Green Bean Coop. I have roasted them more or less as I roast most everything right now, to just before the onset of 2nd crack, with the Lintong roasted a hair lighter (2-3 degrees F). These coffees were cheap (both under $4/lb, green) and in this blend produce a very complex cup that doesn't seem to come into its own until the coffee has aged 4 or more days post roast. Interestingly, it seems to last longer than most coffees I roast for espresso, up to as long as 2 weeks post roast, still producing a very complex and satisfying cup of espresso. This blend works well both in milk and for straight shots.

(3) My Most Disappointing Coffee this year has been the Ethiopian Yirgacheffe Select Biloya, much heralded in the press and purchased from both Paradise and the Coop, and ultimately sourced through Novo. This coffee gets bottom honors from me in part because it never could possibly live up to its hype (or cost). To me, it is the "incredible shrinking coffee." I have had 3 or 4 of the best espressos of my life from this coffee, mostly from the first batch I roasted, and tons of good but not great shots that would have been more enjoyable had I paid $4 for the green instead of $13 including the postage :roll: I've tried several different profiles and the results are always similar. There are 1 or 2 very good (perhaps great) shots hiding in the pound, but the rest are merely good or average. I've never experienced a coffee like this, and can't really explain its behavior. My leading theory at this point is that it has simply gone "over the hill" at a record pace, enjoying a very brief moment in the sun with a very precipitous decline. But I'm not really sure, maybe it is something I'm doing wrong with this coffee.

ken
What, me worry?

Alfred E. Neuman, 1955
Ken Fox
 
Posts: 1070
Joined: Oct 28, 2005
Location: Idaho

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by OkcEspresso on Sun Nov 25, 2007 11:31 am

I'll second the Ismaili. There appears to be no end to the roast those beans can take and still turn up something interesting. I have yet to make the Lintong work for me.

I have the opposite experience with the Biloya. Extraordinary coffee both blended and SO. Each roast keeps getting better.

My big disappointment has been the Brazil Poco Fundo. I cannot find a way to roast it without scorching it. And even though a 50/50 blend of my scorched Poco Fundo and FC Yemen Ismaili is pretty dang good, I still get a little ash in the cup.
OkcEspresso
 
Posts: 91
Joined: Apr 08, 2006
Location: Oklahoma City

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by Ken Fox on Sun Nov 25, 2007 2:21 pm

OkcEspresso wrote:I'll second the Ismaili. There appears to be no end to the roast those beans can take and still turn up something interesting. I have yet to make the Lintong work for me.

I have the opposite experience with the Biloya. Extraordinary coffee both blended and SO. Each roast keeps getting better.

My big disappointment has been the Brazil Poco Fundo. I cannot find a way to roast it without scorching it. And even though a 50/50 blend of my scorched Poco Fundo and FC Yemen Ismaili is pretty dang good, I still get a little ash in the cup.


I don't think the Lintong is necessarily something you want to drink straight; I've only used it in a blend with the Ismaili and also a Harrar Horse.

Jim Schulman gave me a couple of suggestions on roasting the Biloya, which I have tried 4 days ago and I'm about to try the roast results which hopefully will be better. It's been in a sealed valve bag since it was roasted so although I would have preferred to start drinking it yesterday, it is still pretty fresh.

ken
What, me worry?

Alfred E. Neuman, 1955
Ken Fox
 
Posts: 1070
Joined: Oct 28, 2005
Location: Idaho

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by AndyS on Sun Nov 25, 2007 2:38 pm

Ken Fox wrote:the hands-down winner is "Ethiopian Yirgacheffe Adado Coop,"....This coffee, roasted to the onset of first crack or a bit lighter, has never failed to produce an interesting, multidimensional cup.


I know you like it roasted light, but...is this a typo?
-AndyS
AndyS
 
Posts: 648
Joined: May 05, 2005
Location: NY

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by Ken Fox on Sun Nov 25, 2007 3:42 pm

AndyS wrote:I know you like it roasted light, but...is this a typo?


I hope so!

ken
(at least someone read the post)
What, me worry?

Alfred E. Neuman, 1955
Ken Fox
 
Posts: 1070
Joined: Oct 28, 2005
Location: Idaho

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by King Seven on Sun Nov 25, 2007 8:53 pm

Ken Fox wrote: Interestingly, it seems to last longer than most coffees I roast for expresso, up to as long as 2 weeks post roast, still producing a very complex and satisfying cup of espresso.
ken


Personally I am hoping this isn't a typo... ;)
King Seven
 
Posts: 110
Joined: May 26, 2005
Location: London

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by Rainman on Sun Nov 25, 2007 9:06 pm

Ken Fox wrote:I hope so!

ken
(at least someone read the post)


I was hoping the same thing, Ken.. But out of blind faith, I figured you had a reason for the "onset of 1st crack". I thought that was only used for cupping- now I know! If you're telling me that you actually enjoy espresso (or even press-pot coffee, for that matter) that light, you've dropped one notch on my list of those whose posts I read with most interest (it's not a very long list, FWIW)!

Ray

PS. I'm still thinking of an appropriate response to this thread... as my stash is quite eclectic by now!
LMWDP #18
Rainman
 
Posts: 134
Joined: Oct 15, 2006
Location: Tucson

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by Kaffee Bitte on Sun Nov 25, 2007 9:19 pm

King Seven wrote:Personally I am hoping this isn't a typo... ;)


I don't think it is. I have experienced similar length of usefullness in dry process coffees from Ethiopia and Yemen. Often they are not even close to ready for espresso by day four out of the roaster, often still having a carbonated fizzing still. My usual rest for these coffees is six or seven days post roast. YMMV depending on how you store your coffee during the resting period. I use one way valve bags or jars.

More on topic, my top coffee of the moment comes from Chicane Coffee. It is Costa Rica Orosi Valley Estate. Really a very classic coffee, with thick creamy body that I have never experienced in a wet process Costa Rican before. It has some intense caramel sweetness and some nice spicey notes as well. I tend to prefer this one about thirty seconds into second crack, but it is also good lighter than this.
Lynn G.
LMWDP # 110
____________________
User avatar
Kaffee Bitte
 
Posts: 295
Joined: Mar 05, 2007
Location: Missoula, Montana

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by Ken Fox on Sun Nov 25, 2007 10:52 pm

King Seven wrote:Personally I am hoping this isn't a typo... ;)


It isn't. I did a roast session when Jim Schulman was here visiting in the summer, and he had the same observation, that the coffee had a "second wind" after about 10 days.

ken
What, me worry?

Alfred E. Neuman, 1955
Ken Fox
 
Posts: 1070
Joined: Oct 28, 2005
Location: Idaho

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by AndyS on Mon Nov 26, 2007 12:54 am

Ken Fox wrote:It isn't.


So when did you switch from making espresso to making espresso? Is this a French thing? How has the flavor profile changed?
-AndyS
AndyS
 
Posts: 648
Joined: May 05, 2005
Location: NY

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by Ken Fox on Mon Nov 26, 2007 1:17 am

AndyS wrote:So when did you switch from making espresso to making espresso? Is this a French thing? How has the flavor profile changed?


I don't spend any time in Paris, where (hopefully) the situation is better.

I have yet to have a coffee beverage of any kind in France, that if I were home I would not have tossed down the drain and made a new one.

They can call it "espresso" if they wish, but I call it "swill."

Fondly,

ken
:P
What, me worry?

Alfred E. Neuman, 1955
Ken Fox
 
Posts: 1070
Joined: Oct 28, 2005
Location: Idaho

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by SJM on Mon Nov 26, 2007 5:46 pm

Ken Fox wrote:(1) In my "Most Satisfying" category, the hands-down winner is "Ethiopian Yirgacheffe Adado Coop," purchased from both Miguel at Paradise Roasters and from Klatch Coffee Roasters. I believe this is ultimately from the identical source. This coffee, roasted to the onset of 2nd crack or a bit lighter, has never failed to produce an interesting, multidimensional cup. It was not exactly cheap, but not exactly expensive, either. I still have about 20 lbs of it left and continue to enjoy the results I'm getting from it, more than 6 months after the first batch of green that I received.

ken


Thanks for the suggestion, Ken.
And, thanks to HB and to Klatch Coffee for my Holiday Delight.
Today I ordered 2 pounds of the Ethiopian Yirgacheffe Adado Coop green beans, and as if that isn't going to be special enough, I will get a free pound of Belle Espresso.

What a deal !

Susan
SJM
 
Posts: 115
Joined: May 17, 2007
Location: Santa Rosa, California

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by sehrgut on Thu Dec 06, 2007 1:37 pm

My current "Most Satisfying" is something you need to buy from SweetMaria's before they run out: their '04 Aged Mandheling. This coffee has a phenomenal body in the cup, and really roasts up exactly as the cupping notes say. I've never had a bad experience buying from Tom, but this is the first coffee that I've purchased again when I ran out, rather than trying something new. And the way I like to always try something new, that's saying something!
sehrgut
 
Posts: 20
Joined: Jun 18, 2007
Location: Augusta, GA

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by Everman on Sun Dec 16, 2007 11:58 pm

Jacu Bird was the best value this year if you were looking for something avian picked and processed, certainly beats the cat stuff...
Everman
 
Posts: 84
Joined: Nov 26, 2006
Location: urth

Green Bean Coop?

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by jkling17 on Fri Dec 21, 2007 4:51 pm

>> They are Yemen Ismaili and Aged Sumatra Lintong, both purchased from the Green Bean Coop


I can't seem to find the Green Bean Coop anywhere via Google searches. What's the URL?

Thanks!

Jeff
jkling17
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Dec 21, 2007
Location: NJ
www.wholelattelove.com: our caffeinated commitment to you
www.wholelattelove.com: our caffeinated commitment to you

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by Ken Fox on Fri Dec 21, 2007 5:06 pm

jkling17 wrote:>> They are Yemen Ismaili and Aged Sumatra Lintong, both purchased from the Green Bean Coop


I can't seem to find the Green Bean Coop anywhere via Google searches. What's the URL?

Thanks!

Jeff


http://www.greencoffee.coop/

You have to join before you can buy anything. Offerings are sporadic and usually sell out within hours or days. You are generally limited to 15lbs of any particular offering, however they often will offer the same coffee several times so there is the possibility to get more than that. Sales for commercial usage are prohibited.

At the moment, they have nothing for sale.

ken
What, me worry?

Alfred E. Neuman, 1955
Ken Fox
 
Posts: 1070
Joined: Oct 28, 2005
Location: Idaho

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by mrgnomer on Fri Dec 21, 2007 10:38 pm

Most satisfying- good quality Harrar. Blueberry fields.
Least satisfying- bad Harrar. Flat. No blueberries.
Kirk
LMWDP #116
User avatar
mrgnomer
 
Posts: 276
Joined: Jan 15, 2006
Location: Canada

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by pauljolly65 on Sat Dec 22, 2007 12:38 am

Everman wrote:Jacu Bird was the best value this year if you were looking for something avian picked and processed, certainly beats the cat stuff...


That was a good cuppa, and not just a gimmick--although I didn't try it as espresso. The one that's blown me away, cup after cup (again, not as espresso but as drip) has been the Guatemalan Buena Vista Gesha. I had two pounds of it and one of Aida's Grand Reserve, and the Gesha won out. Tons of floral sweetness and perfect balance. I only wish there were more...

Paul
pauljolly65
 
Posts: 85
Joined: Jan 07, 2007
Location: Santa Rosa, CA

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by Niko on Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:50 am

Everman wrote:Jacu Bird was the best value this year if you were looking for something avian picked and processed, certainly beats the cat stuff...
This was an awesome bean. I tried it as espresso and it was really nice.
User avatar
Niko
 
Posts: 279
Joined: Feb 07, 2007
Location: S.F. Bay Area/Sacramento, CA

Link to "What Are Your Most Satisfying, "Best Value," and Most Disappointing Green Coffees?"by Rainman on Sat Dec 22, 2007 11:20 am

I bought an Ethiopian Harrar from a greencoffeebuyingclub distro about 2 yrs ago that had been the easiest to roast to draw out the blueberries. Since then, the only other coffee I've had good consistent roasts from has been that 2006 Yemen Mokha Sana'ani (same distributing source, but we think it was the same one bought through Cafe Imports that got some great reviews as roasted by Coffee Emergency). I still have around 10 lbs of it, and it works great as an espresso SO or blended 50/50 w/ Brazil Poco Fundo-- it's been my favorite. I just bought two more coffees that sound promising (arrived yesterday); a dry processed Yirg and an organic Sidamo, both from Sweet Maria's.

My least favorite (it's all relative) would have to be a Java Estate "Prince G1" that lacks much of the cupped flavor that I read about at nearly all roast levels (prunes, chocolate). There's a little more when roasted well into 2nd crack (rolling, at least), but still has value to tame some of the brighter coffees I have and use in French press. There is no coffee I've ever roasted in recent years that I've had to just throw out-- a testament to finding coffees cupped by capable people, I think.

Ray
LMWDP #18
Rainman
 
Posts: 134
Joined: Oct 15, 2006
Location: Tucson

Next

Return to Home Roasting