Metallic tasting water

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davebm
Posts: 58
Joined: 10 years ago

#1: Post by davebm »

Hi all,

I've had a problem with the water from my Rocket (HX) machine tasting rather metallic. I've compared it to my home tap water and there is a huge difference in flavour -you can really taste the metal - its not even subtle.

I recently disassembled the group to see if I could find a cause for this issue and came across that the chrome plating on the mushroom seems to be stripping off.

Could this be the cause for the metallic tasting water as the water that feeds the group (to my understanding) does not come from the boiler but is fed directly from the tank and just heated by the boiler?

I've attached a picture of the mushroom chrome plating issue.

Could there be any other reasons why my water would taste metallic? :(



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weebit_nutty
Posts: 1495
Joined: 11 years ago

#2: Post by weebit_nutty »

ding ding ding ding :)

The fact that you've got this kind of rust going on tells me this is not the only area affected on the machine. What I would do is strip the machine down and do a full inspection. It's highly disconcerting to see *any* rust on these components given we're talking consuming the water that comes in contact with it. Generally everything on these machines should be rust-proof stainless. But clearly it's not.

Thank you for sharing. BTW, what model is your machine and when was it built?
You're not always right, but when you're right, you're right, right?

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TomC
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#3: Post by TomC »

It's not rust. The mushroom is made of brass as is most of the rest of the entire group assembly, only nickel and chrome plated. So you're not going to find stainless steel in the brew path.

Rusty E61 mushroom - what next?

Rusty E61 mushroom - what next?
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davebm (original poster)
Posts: 58
Joined: 10 years ago

#4: Post by davebm (original poster) »

I descaled the mushroom nicely and the shiny brass came back - it wasn't rust.

A lot of the chrome plating started to flake off during the descale - i am guessing that maybe the chrome plating could be affecting taste as the size of these particles are soo tiny? Not huge chunks at all

Last night I had a look inside the boiler and there wasn't any sign of scale - it was surprisingly clean, if not shiny- bare in mind the machine is now just over two years old and has only been descaled three times.
Thank you for sharing. BTW, what model is your machine and when was it built?

Its a Rocket Evoluzione V2 and I bought it June 2013

Maybe another tidbit of info - It has had this metallic taste from day one when I got the machine. I assumed this was normal. After the pursuit of the perfect espresso I've realized that this is not normal and its depressing me because its now its not only me letting my espresso down but also my machine :(

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weebit_nutty
Posts: 1495
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#5: Post by weebit_nutty »

davebm wrote:I descaled the mushroom nicely and the shiny brass came back - it wasn't rust.

A lot of the chrome plating started to flake off during the descale - i am guessing that maybe the chrome plating could be affecting taste as the size of these particles are soo tiny? Not huge chunks at all

Last night I had a look inside the boiler and there wasn't any sign of scale - it was surprisingly clean, if not shiny- bare in mind the machine is now just over two years old and has only been descaled three times.


Its a Rocket Evoluzione V2 and I bought it June 2013

Maybe another tidbit of info - It has had this metallic taste from day one when I got the machine. I assumed this was normal. After the pursuit of the perfect espresso I've realized that this is not normal and its depressing me because its now its not only me letting my espresso down but also my machine :(
Here's another idea.. taste is greatly affect by your diet, and including any medications you might be taking. This happened to me a few times. Once I was on meds for an itch I couldn't scratch (let's just leave it at that! lol) and everything tasted off. Another time I had cheat week filled with snacks. I gorged onon sugary and salty foods and the following week my coffee tasted like crud. But about a week later everything went back to normal (I avoid sugar wherever possible).

Just an thought. Also, I would look at your water source and ask for a second opinion as well from folks in your household.

Also, I would try to find out what kind fo plating that is. I thought chrome plating was purely for aesthetics, and that for food safe applications, it would be nickel plating, particularly inside boilers. I had an old espresso machine where the nickel was coming loose inside the boiler. It never had any affect on the taste of the water as far as I was aware. If it was chrome plated, I would be concerned. Chromium is not at all foodsafe compared to nickel.
You're not always right, but when you're right, you're right, right?

davebm (original poster)
Posts: 58
Joined: 10 years ago

#6: Post by davebm (original poster) »

Thanks for your views. I don't think its just me but I'll definitely get others to try the water from the machine once I have it up and running again (forgot to order the o-ring on the mushroom.. fail :( )

I did get my girlfriend to try the water and she wasn't too happy with the taste either. I've done tons of reading of what the issue could be - I have even emailed Rocket directly as well for advice and they too aren't too sure what it could be. Andrew from Rocket suggested I send it to one of their distributors here in South Africa, only problem is its 1200km away and I am so worried my machine will get damaged in transit as I no longer have the original packaging.

Once I get the machine back together I'll taste the water again and see if descaling the mushroom manually and other parts within the group helped.

My next option after that - if that doesn't resolve anything - is trying out bottled water only in the system and see if that makes a difference. If that fails I'm going to have to drive my machine down to Cape Town myself and get them to have a look at it.

I love Rocket and the advice they provided me over this time has been great. If I ever upgrade it will definitely be to another Rocket - just on humility and willingness to help alone.

earlgrey_44
Posts: 387
Joined: 15 years ago

#7: Post by earlgrey_44 »

davebm wrote: My next option after that - if that doesn't resolve anything - is trying out bottled water only in the system and see if that makes a difference.
Very good idea. There's nothing abnormal or worrisome in the above posts about the machine to help explain what you're tasting. Water quality going in may well explain it if the water source is unusually high or low in ph, or if the mineral content is unusually high or low in some way. I'd expect a metallic taste from your brew water if the machine was too clean!

I'd suggest you find out what you can about the water you've been using, as well as experimenting with other waters. A little searching on the site here will let you learn much about water issues.
Trust your taste. Don't trust your perception.

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DaveC
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#8: Post by DaveC »

davebm wrote:Maybe another tidbit of info - It has had this metallic taste from day one when I got the machine. I assumed this was normal. After the pursuit of the perfect espresso I've realized that this is not normal and its depressing me because its now its not only me letting my espresso down but also my machine :(
You must be sensitive to copper boilers/HX units the same as I am. I currently have 3 espresso machines. I sold my R58. A Verona, Duetto and Vesuvius. I have always been able to taste a metallic taste in any machine with copper boilers, unless fairly well scaled with limescale. The Duetto is my only remaining copper brew boiler machine (I only keep it for sentimental reasons)...the Veronas brew boiler is brass and the Vesuvius boilers are surgical grade (low corrosion) stainless steel. Even with the Verona dual boiler machine, the service/steam boiler is still copper. it's why I never used to use the hot water from a machine to make a long drink or tea. I suppose I could use the Vesuvius for hot water, but I have a press button dispensing water heater does the job efficiently.

The true test is to drink the water from the machine, first hot, then warm, then cold. if it tastes horrible, then that taste is simply being masked/tainting your espresso. If on an HX machine, you flush loads of water through and drink water that's not been sitting in the HX (it will be a bit cool as you can't let it sit there are all to warm up agai) and it's less metallic, then for certain your the same as me. Most people can't taste this, but a few can.

The only solution I am afraid is to

1. Buy a machine with steel boilers and be absolutely sure any HX unit is steel
2. Buy a machine with a brass brew boiler and don't use the service boiler for HW unless it's steel or brass.

This does rather narrow down your choice of machines e.g. GS3, Vesuvius, Verona and they will mostly be Dual boilers as I am not aware of any HX machines with steel boiler and steel HX units.

P.S. Certain Blood Pressure medications (ACE inhibitors) can make espresso taste metallic for some people, but this is a different thing altogether and won't affect the taste of just water in the espresso machine.