Fausto wrote:I guess it's just because the BDB has so many features that you still don't get out of an Italian machine, I realize the quality isn't as good, but it's packed with features. Just a question of priorities really, and I'm not sure what mine are...

BDB vs Italian Prosumer DB
You're not going to get a better cup out of a high-end prosumer DB than out of a BDB 920XL. In fact, because of the limited preinfusion available with a reservoir fed E61, the BDB gives you more forgiveness. What you buy with the extra $1000 is undeniable counter top presence, and (perhaps) some build quality.

Espresso machines are assemblages of components and even the best components eventually fail. Sometimes, they fail not long after purchase. You can't count on any machine giving you years of trouble free performance, even with appropriate maintenance (they all need maintenance). It's just the way it is. What you get with a really well-built machine that you don't get with a BDB is relative ease in removing and repairing and replacing the components.

There are a lot of people who know the current DB market better than me, but with that caveat I think the most feature laden, prosumer, reservoir fed DB is the La Spaziale Dream T. If you decide to go that way, don't forget to buy the optional preinfusion reservoir and have it installed by the dealer. It ain't much, the equivalent of E61 preinfusion, but better than nothing.

GRINDER GRINDER GRINDER

There are no really good, small espresso grinders. If you're single dosing, the best short choices for in the cup quality are the Compak K10 PB (with a single dose cup), the HG One, the Mahlkonig K30, and the Versalab M3 (without hopper).

The Forte short alright, but not in the same league.

Rich

Great info and perspective Rich. I looked into the La Spaziale's a lot closer, including the Lucca models from Clive, but if anything it just reaffirmed the BDB in my mind. It's the machine with the features I want, and even if the quality isn't all there, it's got a great warranty. With a little bit of luck maybe I'll get 7-8 years out of it!

Yes, I know, grinder grinder grinder! I do love the idea of the Forte, but I'm pretty sure I've got an HG in my future! Feels good to have it figured out. Now I just need to keep pinching my pennies and I should have them both by the end of the summer...unless something new comes out before then!!

Thanks for your help guys. You'll be seeing me around!
Feel free to add any additional thoughts, I'm still listening.

Oops I posted too soon last night.
Meant to say once I have my Strega and grinder the Baratza Virtuoso will go to my office so I can grind my beans for my drip coffee fresh every day

Barb wrote:Oops I posted too soon last night.
Meant to say once I have my Stregaand grinder the Baratza Virtuoso will go to my office so I can grind my beans for my drip coffee fresh every day

Bezzera instead of the HG-one? Or in addition? Why are you going that route? I use my Porlex with a mini Bonavita kettle and an Aeropress at work right now. Thinking about swapping out the Aeropress and the Porlex for the Cafflano Klassic though!

Hi Alex, glad you got to have some great shots and learning up here!

You should definitely plan another trip up with an assortment of your fave beans and some more time, so you can test out these different grinder calibers on some diverse machines. Get a good feel for the cup quality and interface between the Vario/Forte, Compak E6 OD, large flat burr MXD, and hopefully we'll have a big conical here by then. Have you gotten to pull any shots on a La Spaziale? I'd be interested in seeing how you like the flavors of your favorite coffees through modern saturated groups, dual boiler e61s and of course the BDB.

And we'll have to keep you in the loop when we organize the next enthusiast/home roaster event up here! Give us a call or email before your next trip in to Portland.

Hey, Clive Coffee!
Great to hear from you. I've really enjoyed both of my trips to your store, everyone there has always been extremely helpful and knowledgeable! I'm quite a newbie in the espresso world, so that is always appreciated.!

clivecoffee wrote:Hi Alex, glad you got to have some great shots and learning up here!

Definitely looking forward to seeing what you guys have cooked up. Currently I'm leaning in the HG one direction, although I'm by no means someone who enjoys manual grinding! I do actually have the space for a rather large commercial grinder, but it just seems sort of silly to get something that can grind coffee all day long when all I need is like 3-4 shots a day! You should work out a deal with the HG One guys or Versalab or whoever (make your own!). Someone who is making what I'll call "Enthusiast Class" home espresso grinders. Small batch, big burrs!

clivecoffee wrote:Have you gotten to pull any shots on a La Spaziale? I'd be interested in seeing how you like the flavors of your favorite coffees through modern saturated groups, dual boiler e61s and of course the BDB.
And we'll have to keep you in the loop when we organize the next enthusiast/home roaster event up here! Give us a call or email before your next trip in to Portland.

No, I only pulled 3 shots this last time, one on the BDB, one on I believe the M58 Lucca (I wasn't completely paying attention to the machine though), and one on the Single Group Slayer. I really like features and the BDB's got most of them. I think the La Spaziale's are pretty feature packed as well, but I haven't had the chance to play on one yet. Any plans to Lucca-fy the Dream/Dream T?
Anyway, count me in for the next event! I might actually have an excuse to be in Portland this Saturday...we'll see!

clivecoffee wrote:Hi Alex, glad you got to have some great shots and learning up here!

You should definitely plan another trip up with an assortment of your fave beans and some more time, so you can test out these different grinder calibers on some diverse machines. Get a good feel for the cup quality and interface between the Vario/Forte, Compak E6 OD, large flat burr MXD, and hopefully we'll have a big conical here by then. Have you gotten to pull any shots on a La Spaziale? I'd be interested in seeing how you like the flavors of your favorite coffees through modern saturated groups, dual boiler e61s and of course the BDB.

And we'll have to keep you in the loop when we organize the next enthusiast/home roaster event up here! Give us a call or email before your next trip in to Portland.

Southern Oregon here. Someday I would love to take one of your classes.