Questions on Macap Stepless Adjustment and Zeroing

[JimWright]

Ok, so I have a couple of questions on the Macap stepless adjustment mechanism, just having acquired an M7K conical (offered by Chris' Coffee as the MK7R - it arrived last night, review to follow after I actually get familiar with it).

First, should it be possible to go more than a full revolution of the collar adjuster to get to the zero point? I went two full 360 revolutions of the adjuster without hitting it.

Here's how it happened - I zeroed it once successfully, finding the "clicking" point (around 7.5), and then backed it off by 2.5 numbers to get to to espresso-grind territory. I ground a little coffee to make sure it was working, then backed off by another 3 numbers to aim at drip and make a morning pot. However, it still came out really, really fine - much finer than any drip grind I've used or seen.

After playing with it a bit (always adjusting only with the grinder on), I tried to wind it back to the zero point, but now it wouldn't hit that point, even after I went two full revolutions in the "fine" direction, significantly past where I had zeroed it the first time. Ideas?

Also, how far have you folks found between espresso and drip territory? 3/4 of the way around? More than a full turn of the collar? Two or more turns? I had read and been told by Chris (at Chris' Coffee) that it would be 30-40 turns of the screw adjuster to get from espresso to drip, but it seems like I went way, way past that and was still getting a grind in espresso territory.

Lastly, since I have to run the motor while adjusting it, and adjusting with the stepless adjuster is pretty slow, how long can you safely run the motor, and how long do you need to give it to cool down afterward? The burr carrier stayed warm for while after I was trying to adjust it, so I'm letting it cool down completely to room temp before trying again.

Thanks in advance for any advice you can provide!

[forgetcolor]

I don't think you need to keep the motor running while adjusting. I'm certainly not with my M4 stepless. When I first got it, I pulled the number dial off, turned the top burr assembly carefully by hand until it just touched the bottom burrs, then backed off a tiny amount and called that my zero point. I screwed the number dial back on, and started out about 2.5 numbers away for espresso. I then proceeded to find that something closer to 1 number away was the grind I needed.

So, all that to say don't feel like you have to run it to adjust it (as long as you know where your zero is so you don't crash into it), and also that the numbers people have quoted for what gets you in the right ballpark really seems to just get you in the area. Further refinement is unique to the machine.

[cafeIKE]

Also, how far have you folks found between espresso and drip territory?

About 4 feet. The distance between the M4 and Gran Banshee.

IMO, no way you can expect to get decent espresso from a grinder you use for drip. You need to grind a couple of shots worth of coffee to clean out most of the drip detritus for the espresso method. Ditto on the drip to remove the fine espresso grind which will overextract in the drip method. If you use a gold filter for drip, you will have mud in the cup.

The $100-150 for decent drip grinder will pay for itself in reduced espresso frustration and a better drip cup.

[keno]

Jim,

Keep in mind that the MK7R is a conical burr grinder. The instructions you are following are for the M4 which is a flat burr grinder (I assume you're referring to the instructions posted on HB about dialing in a new M4). I'm not certain about this, but I wouldn't be surprised if the adjustment is different given the very different burr sets used by these two grinders.

Cheers,
Ken

[JimWright]

I think I'm just an idiot.

I noticed yesterday that the burr carrier was resting significantly higher than it had started out (showing threads which were not showing before, I could tell because they were white, probably with thread grease), and I think what happened is that after getting it right at first, I got mixed up and started winding the carrier away from finer rather than toward finer when I was trying to get back to zero. (Apparently, going from 1 toward 9, which it looked to me like the little graphic depicted as getting finer, is actually getting coarser. Going toward the smaller number, counting backward, is getting finer. Of course, even if this is right, it doesn't explain how I got it right the first time and then forgot, but, apparently I'm just an idiot. I think perhaps I need to make such adjustments only after actually having a cup of coffee or a shot of espresso... Of course, I ended up with a great presspot grind this morning. The doser didn't like sweeping the large grind though - I think I can ratchet it down a little even for presspot.)

BTW, Keno, I didn't get the zeroing instructions from here - they actually came, printed, along with the manual on a separate inserted piece of paper in english-only. Maybe an addition by Chris'.

All that said, I have another question.

When I first start the grinder, before opening up the hopper, it makes quite a racket for a second or two before settling in to a much quieter even grinding sound - I'm guessing that this is as it's spinning up. Is this normal? (I realize most of my readers here are probably speaking from the perspective of an M4 rather than an M7 or M7 conical, but I'm hopeful that this is a normal thing and not a symptom of something wrong.)

Thanks again in advance everyone and also for the responses so far! Very helpful and I'm very appreciative.

[forgetcolor]

and I think what happened is that after getting it right at first, I got mixed up and started winding the carrier away from finer rather than toward finer when I was trying to get back to zero. (Apparently, going from 1 toward 9, which it looked to me like the little graphic depicted as getting finer, is actually getting coarser.

Don't sweat it. I've had my M4 for two weeks, and I'm still finding myself turning it the wrong way sometimes. For some reason, the labeling on the adjustment ring just isn't intuitive for me.

When I first start the grinder, before opening up the hopper, it makes quite a racket for a second or two before settling in to a much quieter even grinding sound - I'm guessing that this is as it's spinning up. Is this normal? (I realize most of my readers here are probably speaking from the perspective of an M4 rather than an M7 or M7 conical, but I'm hopeful that this is a normal thing and not a symptom of something wrong.)

My M4 doesn't do this. Without beans in, if I hit the switch, it just hums the same sound from on to off. If you had a few leftover beans, it might account for the noise. Also, if you're maybe holding onto the hopper or some other part with your left hand, perhaps that's enabling some part to vibrate until you move that hand? I've seen this with mine, although I wouldn't call the result 'quite a racket' --- it's just a different sound than if it's running and I'm not touching it in any way.

[JimWright]

Don't sweat it. I've had my M4 for two weeks, and I'm still finding myself turning it the wrong way sometimes. For some reason, the labeling on the adjustment ring just isn't intuitive for me.

Yeah, for me it's the little graph, which seems to indicate that you should turn the numbers up to get finer (from 1 toward 9), when in fact it's down (from 9 toward 1) to get finer.

My M4 doesn't do this. Without beans in, if I hit the switch, it just hums the same sound from on to off. If you had a few leftover beans, it might account for the noise. Also, if you're maybe holding onto the hopper or some other part with your left hand, perhaps that's enabling some part to vibrate until you move that hand? I've seen this with mine, although I wouldn't call the result 'quite a racket' --- it's just a different sound than if it's running and I'm not touching it in any way.

Hmmmm. This makes me nervous - I'm not holding the hopper or otherwise touching the machine when it happens, and it's totally consistent.

Basically, it starts off for the first second or so with both (a) a lower pitched and louder electrical sound, which sounds like it's coming from the motor, and (b) what sounds like some vibration inside, both of which then go away leaving only the much quieter whir of the burrs after a second or two of running. This happens whether or not the hopper lid, doser lid, or hopper are mounted, and also whether or not there are beans in the grinder.

If this sounds at all familiar to anyone, I'd be much obliged to hear it, as I'm worried that perhaps something is loose inside or the motor is having trouble spinning up (though the burrs are spinning when it makes the sound as well as afterward).

[Genesis]

That does sound odd..... My M4 spins up instantly when you hit the switch and has just a bit of bearing noise when there's nothing in it....

[JimWright]

Sooo, I emailed the one other guy that I know who has one of these M7 conicals (also purchased from Chris') this morning, asking if his was also louder and different sounding for the first second or two, and he said his is the same.

I am following up with him to make sure his sound is really the same one (both the vibration and the louder motor sound, after studying it this morning perhaps too obsessively...), but I'm guessing that's just the sound a big conical makes!

Of course, any more input would be welcome, esp. from M7 owners or users, conical or otherwise.