What to do about rust in a new espresso machine?

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Simon345
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#1: Post by Simon345 »

Purchased a Linea Mini some months back. When I slide out the water reservoir I can see the rail that the water reservoir slides along towards the rear (inside) of the machine has worn off the paint, and there is both an area that is noticeably beginning to rust, as well as an area where the paint is gone and rust is imminent. Has anyone else with a Linea Mini experienced this? Seems crap that a machine worth nearly $5,000 is rusting so soon, even a smaller area like this.

Have you been in this situation with a high end home machine (La Marzocco or other)? How would you approach it? For example:

* Is it acceptable for a tech to come out with some touch up paint and a small brush and go over the affected area? Would that kind of fix last?

* Does the machine need to be taken away and properly re-sprayed?

* On a high value machine so new would you look to return it?


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randomorbit
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#2: Post by randomorbit »

I'm so glad you showed a picture, because from your description it sounded serious. No I don't think it's reasonable to have a tech come out and put some touch-up paint on it, because it would take you 2 minutes to do it yourself. The good folks at LM won't tell you you're being crazy, because you paid them $5000 for an espresso machine, but I owe you nothing, so I can tell it like it is.

Yes the touch-up paint will wear off again, and if you're fussy about it you can keep touching it up. Since the water reservoir slides against the paint, it will keep wearing off there, but it won't rust, as long as you are using it regularly, because the rust will rub off easier than the paint did. If it bothers you, you could maybe add some felt or something like that to the rails if there is room so that the tray slides along the felt instead of metal, but you could also use it just like that for decades, and it would not rust out.

I'm assuming that is plain steel, and not stainless, but it might be stainless, some SS alloys do have mild surface rust especially if exposed to something acidic. Someone more familiar with the construction of your machine might know for sure, but even if it's not SS, I think it should last the life of the machine as long as you keep it clean. I've seen abused La Marzocco machines in cafes that are decades old, it's a serious shame, and it makes me sad to see them so abused, but they a still going strong.

So the tough love portion of this post is over. That's a beautiful well built machine you have there. It was built to take abuse that you clearly would never subject it to. Keep it clean, touch up the paint if it bugs you, or just leave it alone. Either way this machine should serve you well for many many years.

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AssafL
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#3: Post by AssafL »

randomorbit wrote: Yes the touch-up paint will wear off again, and if you're fussy about it you can keep touching it up. Since the water reservoir slides against the paint, it will keep wearing off there, but it won't rust, as long as you are using it regularly, because the rust will rub off easier than the paint did. If it bothers you, you could maybe add some felt or something like that to the rails if there is room so that the tray slides along the felt instead of metal, but you could also use it just like that for decades, and it would not rust out.
I used pads (to quieten a 2008 firesale GS/3) which I recommend against - the adhesive bakes because of the heat and becomes impossible to remove.

That being said, I wouldn't care. This machine will outlast many of its internal components. So you will have to open it up one day - and use wrenches and allen keys. You'll replace components. It will eventually have dings and scratches. And it will be as good as the day you bought it.

My guess is that the surface prep wasn't perfect before painting (probably an Italian subcontractor). Touch it up, put some thick oil on it, or just leave it be (the latter is what I would do).
Scraping away (slowly) at the tyranny of biases and dogma.

ira
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#4: Post by ira »

Or call them and ask. It would be interesting to hear their response.

Ira

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SonVolt
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#5: Post by SonVolt »

Despite what anyone above says, that's absolutely unacceptable on a $5000 machine. My machine costs half as much and came factory stocked with stainless steel guide rails to prevent this very issue.

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randomorbit
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#6: Post by randomorbit replying to SonVolt »

And my Gaggia classic was 1/25th the price, and it also doesn't have any paint to chip. If you want an all stainless steel machine, there are certainly many to choose from at prices way below $5000, but if you are looking for a commercial class machine, like what you find in the best cafes, then chances are you'll be looking mostly at machines with some painted steel in the chassis, and paint will chip sooner or later. La Marzocco is not famous for their finish quality, they are famous for the quality of the coffee you can make with them.

In a lot of ways what is valuable in a high volume cafe is not the same as what is valuable in a home kitchen, but a lot of us, myself included, get into high quality tools, and see professional tools as the ultimate, and whether I need it or not, dammit I want that Viking range, and I want a Linea too! Of course professional tools cost a lot more than consumer grade ones, and when you get to the point of spending thousands of dollars on a coffee maker, it's tempting to think of it as a piece of jewelry, but that's not what it is for. So, take good care of it, keep it clean, polish it lovingly if that's your thing, but hopefully a nice machine like that is getting used, and not just looked at, and if it's getting used sooner or later it's going to get a scratch on it. If you want to be happy with your stuff, I say embrace it for what it is, use it, love it, and think of the wear marks as a sign of a being well used tool, not a museum piece.

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AssafL
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#7: Post by AssafL »

randomorbit wrote:And my Gaggia classic was 1/25th the price, and it also doesn't have any paint to chip. If you want an all stainless steel machine, there are certainly many to choose from at prices way below $5000, but if you are looking for a commercial class machine, like what you find in the best cafes, then chances are you'll be looking mostly at machines with some painted steel in the chassis, and paint will chip sooner or later. La Marzocco are not famous for their finish quality, they are famous for the quality of the coffee you can make with them.

In a lot of ways what is valuable in a high volume cafe is not the same as what is valuable in a home kitchen, but a lot of us, myself included, get into high quality tools, and see professional tools as the ultimate, and wether I need it or not, dammit I want that Viking range, and I want a Linea too! Of course professional tools cost a lot more than consumer grade ones, and when you get to the point of spending thousands of dollars on a coffee maker, it's tempting to think of it as a piece of jewelry, but that's not what it is for. So, take good care of it, keep it clean, polish it lovingly if that's your thing, but hopefully a nice machine like that is getting used, and not just looked at, and if it's getting used sooner or later it's going to get a scratch on it. If you want to be happy with your stuff, I say embrace it for what it is, use it, love it, and think of the wear marks as a sign of a being well used tool, not a museum piece.
That is a good distinction. The GS/3 is not really a top-end home machine - but at the lowest end of a commercial single group lineup. I have indeed been served espresso from GS/3 at various restaurants and even small cafes (or larger ones during ramp-up - I think even Sightglass in San Francisco were using GS/3 shot pullers while they were building the roastery).

In a car analogy - it is not a Ferrari or a Mercedes. It is an F150 or a Hilux.
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Terranova
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#8: Post by Terranova »

AssafL wrote: In a car analogy - it is not a Ferrari or a Mercedes. It is an F150 or a Hilux.
The automotive standard is the highest and on a Ferrari or Mercedes in particular.
For surfaces the highest standard is Yacht built quality which is a flawless surface but costs 5 times more than the 2nd best.
So the last 10% costs 5 times the work to get to a 90% finish.

Simon, in your case it's not worth it generating negative energy for that.
Deal with it and enjoy that super cool Strada Mini.

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tohenk2
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#9: Post by tohenk2 »

If you don't want to see the rust, or are afraid the rust will spread or something like that, I think you best get a steel brush, get it as clean as possible (should take about a minute or maybe two) and then apply some Hammerite paint. It is made to cover and stabilize rust. I have used it (white!) with great results in a cast iron bathtub (from around 1900).

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tohenk2
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#10: Post by tohenk2 »

Terranova wrote:So the last 10% costs 5 times the work to get to a 90% finish.
Sounds like the law of diminishing returns :wink:

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