One week with the La Marzocco GS3 - Page 5

[AndyS]

Obviously you gave the subject a lot of thought before posting this very level-headed writeup, Dan. Kudos to you.

[Marshall]

Subsequently I would dock its Convenience / Features score due to the ungainly layout of the steam arm / steam arm toggle / brew button array. I'm hopeful that a smart product ergonomics design engineer will revisit the prototype control panel layout too. It's bank of same-sized buttons offer poor visual clues and no tactical clues to their different purposes.

Dan, thanks for sharing your experience. I wonder if you would have applied the same criticism to the current control panel (shown here)?



I also wonder how many other current changes would have affected its ease of use and performance and how many lie ahead before production begins.

[HB]

I wonder if you would have applied the same criticism to the current control panel (shown here)?

First of all, let me state that everyone is an expert on ergonomics (or at least thinks they are).

I may be slightly more attuned to the subtleties because I worked for several years in a usability lab studying human/computer interaction (video cameras, two-way mirrors, pre and post-test interviews, etc.). Our company hires PhD research scientists to study these questions because literally millions of dollars are at risk if a product suffers poor usability (and yet it still happens all the time, but don't get me started). I was a programmer, designer, and tester working under the supervision of usability experts and some of their critical analysis skills rubbed off on me. Obviously computers and espresso machines are different product domains, but when it comes to control panels, I've seen what works well and what tends to test poorly.

Now ask yourself a few easy questions:

• Could someone with a visual impairment use the product with the same efficacy as someone with no impairment?
• Is there a clear visual hierarchy? Looking at the product, can you tell at a glance what's important and what's infrequently used?
• What are the common tasks and what areas does the user's line of sight and hands traverse to accomplish them?
• When a control acquisition failure occurs, how negatively is the user's experience impacted?

Back to the GS3, ponder the questions above while visualizing yourself at the helm. Where do you see a problem? I see many. None are even close to what one would characterize as a fatal flaw, but there's no risk of its ergonomics winning any awards. To answer your question directly, the new panel design doesn't appear to address any of my egonomic concerns. On the positive side, it is pretty and I bet the glow looks really cool in a dimly lit kitchen.

[another_jim]

The GS3 is very tempting, and I may even end up skipping a vacation or two and getting it. But in the end, owning one wouldn't help me answer my espresso questions.

I think at this point the research boundary has moved to exploring and then testing specific questions about within-shot profiles:
-- pressure profiles, whether preinfusion followed by declining pressure, a la lever machines, is better, and if so how?
-- temperature profiles, is the HX hump better than the dual boiler straight line, and if so how?
(and if one more person says "smoother," I'll barf; even though I've said it enough times myself.)

Andy has handled the pressure part closed loop -- would a less exotic setup with an accurate gauge and well tapered motor dimmer be good enough, albeit not as accurate?

Sean is thinking about systems that can create any type of in-shot temperature profiles; and these may turn out to require fairly exotic gear too. Would an old-line thermosyphoned HX, modded to control the HX and group head temperatures at independently settable values, get us started? We already do this informally by varying flush regimes, but it requires several temperature monitoring points, and maybe PIDed or front panel adjustable thermosyphon restrictors. Such mods don't require nearly the same level of technology as fully programmable temp profiles, and they could provide several different, with luck, reliably repeatable, curves.

What I'm saying is that a lot of our purchases are not just driven by getting great espresso, but also getting enough control to see exactly how great espresso happens. Since our conversation has moved away from getting precision and on to getting different types of profiles, the GS3 may not be able to play a part in it.

[AndyS]

I think at this point the research boundary has moved to exploring and then testing specific questions about within-shot profiles:
-- pressure profiles, whether preinfusion followed by declining pressure, a la lever machines, is better, and if so how?
-- temperature profiles, is the HX hump better than the dual boiler straight line, and if so how?

We all know that the humped profile makes smoother espresso.

Just kidding.

What I'm saying is that a lot of our purchases are not just driven by getting great espresso, but also getting enough control to see exactly how great espresso happens. Since our conversation has moved away from getting precision and on to getting different types of profiles, the GS3 may not be able to play a part in it.

Bill Crossland said that the GS3's brain board has the extra capacity required for pressure profiling control. But since the number of people who would be willing to pay the upcharges involved are low, it may be a while before that happens. Unless...researchers find it is useful and customers start to demand it. LM listens to customers.

But concerning the temperature profile, that ain't gonna change much.

[AndyS]

Dan, thanks for sharing your experience. I wonder if you would have applied the same criticism to the current control panel?

I also wonder how many other current changes would have affected its ease of use and performance and how many lie ahead before production begins.

From your picture, it look like the current panel uses pretty much the same layout as the old one (shown below). In my experience, it is easy to mix up the buttons. Of course, that tendency goes away after a while.




I was hoping LM would keep the revisions I made to the display on their final production versions, but alas, I don't think they will.

[Marshall]

From your picture, it look like the current panel uses pretty much the same layout as the old one (shown below). In my experience, it is easy to mix up the buttons. Of course, that tendency goes away after a while.

It's the same sequence you normally see on automatics: single ristretto, double ristretto, single, double. The steam, water sequence on the right might differ from some. I thought that moving the icons directly to the buttons, as LM has now done, might be less confusing to someone who was completely unfamiliar with commercial machines. I didn't notice any confusion among the Homecoming consumer users (apart from the ones who had no idea how to make espresso). It's child's play compared to any Sony remote control.

In any event I suspect anyone paying $4,500 for an espresso machine will read the part of the manual that explains what the 6 buttons do. Actually, I have two of the manuals (Installation and Software Programming) for anyone who has questions (sorry, no pressure programming).

[HB]

In any event I suspect anyone paying $4,500 for an espresso machine will read the part of the manual that explains what the 6 buttons do.

I agree wholeheartedly, anyone with a triple digit IQ will figure it out in seconds.

Mini-rant: As part of my work in user interface design, I debate this point frequently and your comment typifies the attitude of most software developers - "they'll learn how to use it." Of course, the purpose of good product design is to enable the progressive discovery of the system's capabilities, not rely on the user's accommodation of its shortcomings. I'll accept excuses for products that are price performers, but those who wish to claim they're at the top of the pile must not only provide superior performance and gee-whiz features, but a superior user experience. Delivering the GS3's performance surely required lots of "out of the box" thinking; I assume the decision to start with GS1/GS2 components led to the "in the box" issues I'm quibbling about.

Does this look familiar? Over thirty years since its introduction and nobody could improve on its layout? Right...


Photos of 1970ish GS1 courtesy of elysian (flickr)


Paul Pratt pulls shots from his restored GS1 at the SCAA conference in Charlotte (flickr)

[another_jim]

Bill Crossland said that the GS3's brain board has the extra capacity required for pressure profiling control. But since the number of people who would be willing to pay the upcharges involved are low, it may be a while before that happens. Unless...researchers find it is useful and customers start to demand it. LM listens to customers.

If you want to experience a vast universe of dashed hopes, take a survey of all the unused I/O ports on CPUs and unimplemented functions buried in the code of software packages. If sensors and actuators had followed the same price/performance path as processing, we'd all be robots by now.

[AndyS]

If you want to experience a vast universe of dashed hopes, take a survey of all the unused I/O ports on CPUs and unimplemented functions buried in the code of software packages. If sensors and actuators had followed the same price/performance path as processing, we'd all be robots by now.

True, no doubt, but Bill C has said, "We are working on the controls and software for controlling pressure profiles." So in the end, this particular hope may not be dashed. Maybe.

[Marshall]

Over thirty years since its introduction and nobody could improve on its layout? Right...

Well, all the knobs have been replaced by switches. What other layout changes would you have made, Dan?

FWIW, I would have handed the case design over to Kees. The extra design and fabrication costs would probably have been earned back in won-over-spouse sales. On the other hand, when you have a long waiting list, it doesn't give the manufacturer a lot of incentive to make changes purely for style reasons.

[Nick]

The sort of ergonomic design that Kehny is talking about isn't something that any machine manufacturer that I can think of has really attempted.

Is it awkward? Perhaps... but compared to what? The tamping movement, the remove the portafilter movement, the insert the portafilter movement, the dosing-lever movement... each of these is awkward.

On our 3-group Synesso, we use the left steam wand 99% of the time, because the grinders are set to the right. The problem is, the wand lever is on the left, which means that a right-handed person has to cross over their left to pull the lever, or switch hands. It stinks. But we never complained. Such is the baristas' lot in life.

Some people will never be satisfied until you can make world-class espresso by pressing a remote control button from your couch. *shrug* I already spend too much time on the couch as it is.

(side-note... Dan: I guess you won't have to make that trip to Atlanta in September after all. )

[jrtatl]

(side-note... Dan: I guess you won't have to make that trip to Atlanta in September after all. )

If I may: What is going on in Atlanta in September? I live in " 'lana" (as the locals say) and am just curious.

[HB]

The extra design and fabrication costs would probably have been earned back in won-over-spouse sales.

I've been involved in the design and launch of a number of software products. Letting your hard work into the wild to be judged by thoughtless critics who have no appreciation of the effort poured into its creation isn't pleasant. But costs mount every day that the product remains in development and market windows don't stay open forever. From what I've seen, it's clear Bill et al made the right choices given the constraints.

As for the bank-of-buttons versus an alternative, I think the paddle has an irresistible "push here" attraction. Paul Pratt tricked his out for the SCAA show:


Is it real, or is it Photoshop? (flickr)

The sort of ergonomic design that Kehny is talking about isn't something that any machine manufacturer that I can think of has really attempted.

Really? I thought Elektra did a pretty nice job of combining function and looks, as noted in my research notes from the Buyer's Guide to the Elektra A3, excerpted below:

The big appeal of E61-type lever machines is the coolness. I jokingly refer to this as THE REALLY BIG BUTTON factor. But for an E61, it is functional and cool at the same time. Returning to the A3, note its brew activation lever:



When I saw the teenie-tiny picture from the Elektra website, I wondered what the heck the cam lever was doing way up high on the grouphead. Once I had it in-house and the covers off, I saw the bare truth:

IT'S A REALLY BIG LEVER THAT DOESN'T DO MUCH OF ANYTHING

Note: You should click the first link of this entry to get the joke.

My mind reeled at the ways I would chide Elektra for creating such an elaborate way of a pushing a button. I mean puh-leez, a six inch woodgrain handle to flick a microswitch? Can you say "a little over the top"?

However, keeping an open mind is a key part of writing a quality review, so I mentally moved on and gave no further thought to its prominent protuberance. Ironically my wife commented later the same day, "Hey, I really like those woodgrain knobs and levers. It's much prettier than Junior."

Granted, she's bigger and unquestionably more stylish.

To the point of today's entry: Pretty as the fancy lever is, it ain't just for show. Somebody at Elektra thought to position it near the steam toggle switch and align it such that your hand is naturally right next to it when steaming. Flipping the lever down / flicking the switch of most machines to cut off the pump requires you reach away from where you're focusing while frothing. That's miffed me more than once when I've accidentally injected a splotch of big bubbles.

Not with the A3. Your hand is nary an inch away. Flick one, pump off. Flick two, steam off. Thunk and pour. Big Elektra Lever, today you earned yourself a "good idea" emoticon!

I thought the Synesso's "big switches" served the same purpose, but I don't have enough time with the machine to have an opinion on how effective its layout works. At least the Synesso's steam switch isn't directly beneath the steam arm.

If I may: What is going on in Atlanta in September? I live in " 'lana" (as the locals say) and am just curious.

I don't follow Nick's comment either, but I think he's referring to the SERBC. Last I looked, the calendar on the SCAA didn't mention it. There was talk of holding it in Atlanta, not Chapel Hill (NC). If the competition is held in Atlanta, it's a great excuse to go on a roadtrip and crash Bob Roseman's place.

[AndyS]

Flipping the lever down / flicking the switch of most machines to cut off the pump requires you reach away from where you're focusing while frothing.

Of course, this doesn't matter if you run the GS3 in automatic mode. For cappas only, of course.

[Marshall]

But costs mount every day that the product remains in development and market windows don't stay open forever.

Ha! I've watched tinkering, perfectionist engineers burn through every penny of venture capital before they ever got to market. The experience left me wary of companies that don't have some managerial brakes on the engineers.

[HB]

Of course, this doesn't matter if you run the GS3 in automatic mode. For cappas only, of course.

"Daddy, Uncle Andy is saying bad things..."

[AndyS]

"Daddy, Uncle Andy is saying bad things..."

I swear I only used the auto buttons to preprogram a two-second flush.

[Marshall]

I swear I only used the auto buttons to preprogram a two-second flush.

I used them to pull shots, which is to say I hit them once to start the shot and a second time to stop it.

[jrtatl]

I don't follow Nick's comment either, but I think he's referring to the SERBC. Last I looked, the calendar on the SCAA didn't mention it. There was talk of holding it in Atlanta, not Chapel Hill (NC). If the competition is held in Atlanta, it's a great excuse to go on a roadtrip and crash Bob Roseman's place.

Well, that could be fun. I live all of 10-15 minutes from Bob (I don't know if he remembers that I've been to his house for a geekfest he organized a year or two ago).

If the SERBC is held in ATL, will they have a judge's certification course? I'd love to take it and participate, even if it means eating bland food for a couple of days.