Looking to start homeroasting soon. Some ?'s

[Kaffee Bitte]

I plan to start homeroasting somewhere in mid may (Once my school is done for the semester.) I was looking at the Fresh Roast 8 Plus or the Nesco, maybe the I-Roast 2. Hoping to get some user thoughts on these roasters. I will be roasting for my personal use and figured I would go with one of the lower end options until I had some experience under my belt. I presently own a pavoni stradivari and use a bodum press pot regularly. I normally go through about a pound and a half to two pounds of coffee a week. I know that these three machines don't roast large amounts at a time, but given one or two roasting sessions a week would I be able to pump out enough coffee? I am willing to answer other questions about possible use if needed.
Thanks
Lynn

[cafeIKE]

Lets go metric and say 750g per week, about 1.5 pounds

iRoar = ~150 = 5 roasts per week [ RpW ]
FR+ = ~75 = 10 RpW
Nesco = ~125 = 6 RpW

The iRoar is way too loud, the FR too fast for optimum espresso and the Nesco is too slow.

[Kaffee Bitte]

So what would be the better route?

It is also possible for me to get fresh roasted local coffee, so I might not have to roast all of my coffee.

[miKe mcKoffee]

So what would be the better route?

It is also possible for me to get fresh roasted local coffee, so I might not have to roast all of my coffee.

For an off the shelf without modding home roaster? HotTop #1, Gene Cafe #2.

[cafeIKE]

I've home roasted for over 7 years and continually vascillate between giving it up because it's a hassle on one hand and the inability to get great coffee locally 100% of the time. Just this week I dumped a pound of local professional coffee as it was flat, boring and a complete waste of time.

The original HotTop as stock is tolerable for espresso. The programable maybe better, but it's almost a kilobuck. Some like the GeneCafe. Either of these is going to be 3 to 4 RpW. Including setup, between roast cleaning and cooling, and teardown, that's about 3 hours on the HotTop.

If I wanted to roast 1kg or more per week, I'd look at a $ample roa$ter and give the excess to my friends.

Some like BBQ drums, but that might be a long winter in Helena.

There other options like Stir Crazies and the Stove Top that handle the quantities, but they are bit less automated.

[Kaffee Bitte]

Stir Crazies? I have seen it referenced multiple times but still not sure what it is.
I can deal with Non automation. I presently am using a lever machine with a hand grinder (though I just pulled the trigger on a electric burr). If I have to go the stovetop route I will. I was kind of contemplating that anyway.
My thoughts though were to use the Fresh roast + to get my leg up on roasting. Then switch to a more formidable format.
The BBQ roasters wouldn't get up to a high enough temp in the winters up here? Mind you that winter in Helena is very strangely variable. Often we will see two or three weeks or more into 40 F or more. There are often times climbs into the 60's. Might be worth it though just to go that route and buy artisans through the winter.

[cafeIKE]

My thoughts though were to use the Fresh roast + to get my leg up on roasting.

If you want to get a leg up on roasting, then something more controllable than an FR maybe in order. It's uncontrollably variable with ambient temperature and voltage variations. I use mine with a TC, a variac and an external regulated power supply for sample roasting.

n00b [home] roasters equate roast end point as the grail of roasting when the profile by which the endpoint is achieved has as much or more to do with the quality of the coffee. So if you want to learn to roast coffee, something that allows you to vary and repeat a profile is mandatory.

Neither the iRoar or the GeneCafe give true bean temperature, so profile repeatability maybe suspect. Add in voltage and ambient condition changes and the actual profile repeatabiliy maybe close to zero. These variations also affect many professional roasters, hence the hit and miss quality of their wares.

[Kaffee Bitte]

So how much of a PITA is the stovetop method? Am I going to be chucking large quantities of coffee for awhile if I go that route? I have a camp stove that would work for it, plus I have a garage which I can roast in (at least in winter). I know that at the moment the Hottop or Gene is out of my price range. I dropped a good deal of funding on my machine and grinding options. A price point above about 200-300 is going to be too much for a good year or so according to my pocketbook.
Lynn

[gtrman]

i am not an experienced roaster, so i hesitated to post...but what the hey!
what ive been doing so far, is stovetop roasting in a small stainless bowl. now i too am waiting for school to be done for the semester before going crazy with it, but my first couple tries were not bad in my book. so a few weeks back i was buying new sneakers at kohls (sp?) and right next to me they has a "nut roaster" on sale for $8. what it is, is a doughnut shaped pan, with a crank on top, and 2 arms that agitate whatever is in the bottom of the pan. similar to a stovetop popcorn popper like the ones on Sweet Maria's, but it was alot cheaper than any ive seen. ive only used it once so far, and it looked and smelled quite good, but being a clumsy oaf, i dropped the whole thing into the sink/garbage disposal trying to put it into my cooling vessels.
but anyways, with practice, this seems to be the most cost effective way to break into roasting.
best of luck
-jeff

[Kaffee Bitte]

I know that my roasting skills are going to take time to develop. I have no problem with that. Patience is something I have in great quantities. Where might I come across such a nut roaster, being that I live in a smallish town with fewer mega stores than most?
Lynn

[gtrman]

they have some on amazon.com, but they are ~$25. i got mine on clearence so im not totally sure if any of those sales are going on anywhere. other than that stovetop popcorn poppers on sweetmarias.com seem to be the prefered method over the nut roaster, but the nut roaster was so cheap i couldnt resist.
-jeff

[keno]

I plan to start homeroasting somewhere in mid may (Once my school is done for the semester.) I was looking at the Fresh Roast 8 Plus or the Nesco, maybe the I-Roast 2. Hoping to get some user thoughts on these roasters.

Lynn,

Congrats on taking up home roasting -- it's fun, a good learning experience, and has the potential to make great coffee. As to your question. I would consider the i-Roast 1 (not the 2). The differences are trivial and the price of the 2 is a lot more. You can get the i-Roast 1 for as little as $109 now (with 3 lbs of coffee) at Burman Coffee Traders. A lot of people are recommending the Gene Cafe or the Hottop which understandably you are probably reluctant to spend that much on until you decide whether you really enjoy home roasting. That's why I'd suggest the i-Roast 1 - it won't break the bank and then in a year or so you can upgrade.

None of these machines is perfect (or even great), but they work and can reliably produce better coffee than you can buy in the store. The i-Roast temperature control and profiles are a joke (another reason why it's silly to waste extra money on the 2 - it's just a machine with buttons that don't really do anything for $60 more). I've posted on this problem and how lower temperature longer roasts seem to work better for me with the i-Roast:
http://www.home-barista.com/forum...eriment-t3086.html

Then again a better alternative might be the following: http://www.home-barista.com/forum...project-t3718.html

Cheers,
Ken

[prof_stack]

You're a student, right? So you don't have a lot of extra income laying around, correct?

IMO, the best way to get into home roasting is to use a hot-air popper. Poppery II and similar ones are usually available at thrift stores for less than $5 and so with virtually no expense you can learn the craft and roast some great coffee. For the $ it costs you to get an i-roast or FR8, etc. you can add on other equipment cheaply and still be ahead of the game.

THEN you'll have a better idea how deeply you want to get into the home roasting hobby. Take your time and you'll learn as you go.

[miKe mcKoffee]

IMO, the best way to get into home roasting is to use a hot-air popper. Poppery II and similar ones are usually available at thrift stores for less than $5 and so with virtually no expense you can learn the craft and roast some great coffee. For the $ it costs you to get an i-roast or FR8, etc. you can add on other equipment cheaply and still be ahead of the game.

If you do take to scouring thrift stores be especially on the look out for a P1 (original WestBend The Poppery). It's built like a tank and easier to modify having both AC heater and fan. (versus most other poppers having DC fan) P1 simply split input wired heater and fan for independent control, paired with variable boost voltage (ala variacs etc) to each yields a roaster quite capable of excellent roast profiling and 1/2# roast batches.

[danblev]

I'll also recommend either the FR-8 + a viriac or or the i-Roar + ear plugs (I don't have a Nesco).
I have used both ad both options make good coffee when mastered.

Using the FR-8 is more of an art and with the i-Roast it is easier to reproduce a roast.
Patience is your best companion.

You will need a good way to measure the beans before roast. A digital scale is the best way to go, but you can start out measuring by volume. Air roasters are very fussy about the amount of beans you use.

If you get the FR-8 then you will need a timer; preferably a digital one that has clear big digits and that is easy to use. Following a roast profile is very important.

From my experience, I still use my modified FR-8 for sample roasting and don't use my I-Roast2 anymore. I wasn't ever able to really setup a profile I wanted with the I-Roast while with the FR-8 I have a carefully laid out 10 minutes roast and it makes great coffee.

As for the amount of beans. The I-Roast will roast about 4-5 oz and the FR-8 about 2-3 oz; both depend on your local voltage and profile.
I am not sure how you manage to consume 1.5-2 lbs of coffee/week, take into account that coffee looses 15% - 20% weight during roast and the weights are all for green coffee.

¢¢

[DigMe]

I have an FR+8, a few Poppery II's or similar, a Poppery I and two Stir Crazy/Convection Oven (hereafter referred to as SC/COs) setups. I use the SC/COs most often because they give me the biggest batch size and it adds a lot of controlability (though still with flaws). The Poppery I is really a fantastic machine though. I do weekly decaf batches in mine for a group I have over every week and it gives a great, even roast. I don't yet have a variac but I do have some amount of control by tweaking various aspects of it. I cut out the bottom for increased airflow and I set it on a fan blowing up to slow down larger batches a bit. I also plug it into a long extension cord. If I feel like speeding up any given roast I can take it off the fan and put it on a flat surface or I can also quickly unplug it from the extension cord and straight into the power strip. When people say that those suckers are built like tanks they are right! Mine was pulled of an outside table at least twice by my dogs and crashed to the concrete porch where they then chewed on it and scratched at it. The thing runs like it always did. I feel like I've come closer to mastering the process with this machine moreso than any other.

Having said all that, considering your consumption the SC/CO might be your best option for the larger batch sizes and controllability. It really needs to be monitored with a thermocouple though because the thermostat has a wide deadband. My main CO has a light that comes on when it is heating and turns off when it's not. I sit there and watch the temps and I've got a pretty good method down of turning off the heating element as it approaches the target and then turning it back on right before it starts to dip. I can keep the air temp within a 6 to 8 degree range this way but I have to watch it closely.

bc

[Rainman]

It really needs to be monitored with a thermocouple though because the thermostat has a wide deadband. My main CO has a light that comes on when it is heating and turns off when it's not. I sit there and watch the temps and I've got a pretty good method down of turning off the heating element as it approaches the target and then turning it back on right before it starts to dip. I can keep the air temp within a 6 to 8 degree range this way but I have to watch it closely.

bc

That's exactly what I've resorted to doing, but I just came to that conclusion by trial-and-error. I have a variac, but dialing down the variac as you get into 1st crack to slow the roast down also slows the convection fan in the CO and rather complicates things- for me, the temp still climbs due to lack of turbulent air flow and it's faster to control by just turning the temp knob down on the CO to turn off the heating element directly (kind of like a manual PID). I've not tried roasting w/o the variac to see if temp control would be even trickier.

Where do you place the tip of your thermocouple?

Ray

[Kaffee Bitte]

Ok, One question that hasn't been answered. What exactly is the SC/CO? Or more to the point could someone post a pic of what the contraption looks like. That way I won't be totally lost on this board. Thanks

[DigMe]

Where do you place the tip of you thermocouple?

Ray

I've lately been placing it hanging just below the fan to monitor air temp. I haven't decided if I want to keep doing this or go back to trying to monitor bean mass temp. I've gotten good roasts both ways.

bc

[Rainman]

Ok, One question that hasn't been answered. What exactly is the SC/CO? Or more to the point could someone post a pic of what the contraption looks like. That way I won't be totally lost on this board. Thanks

SC/CO just stands for "stir-crazy/convection oven", and like it sounds is a combination roaster made from two products- there's also the SC/TO, where the "TO" stands for turbo-oven... same thing.

Here's a couple of links I found helpful (they also have some fairly good step-by-step instructions w/ pictures):

http://biobug.org/coffee/turbo-crazy/

http://turbocrazy.atspace.com/

There may be a bit of a breakdown in terms of figuring out exactly how to go about modding the equipment, so I'd read as many of those to get an idea of what has worked for most and go from there... if you're into that sort of thing (I am, and I like mine).

Ray