Looking for espresso/coffee machine for moms birthday. Help?

[Freezebyte]

Greetings all, names Bryce and my google searching for information about espresso machines turned up this link so I figured I'd register and get some more input as I'm all about information and input before making a purchase, especially for something like this.

A few years ago, my sister and I jointly purchased an off brand espresso machine so my mom could make her stuff at home instead of always buying it. She loved it and used it quite alot, especially during school days when she teaches. Eventually however, the extreme hard water in our area clogged up the machine and even after trying to flush it out with mineral deposit cleaner agents, it was to no avail and it had to be trashed.

Fast forward today, I overheard her wishing she had a newer coffee and espresso machine and her birthday is nearing the beginning of next month and I thought this would be a perfect gift for her from me and my dad seeings how I know were gonna have to spend a bit to get a decent one.

That being said, i've been doing some preliminary research and this is what i've found. My town isn't very large so the local availability basically sucks. I've mostly been coming up with Krups, Delonghi and Bialetti, but mostly krups.

The more decent stores around my town is Linen and Things has a few Krups models available for a pretty good price, also with coupons. Seeings how my mom would like a nicer coffee machine AND a espresso, I was pleased to find that some companies offer dual models instead of purchasing separately. However, initial internet research has come up with the Krups doesn't seem to be a well favored brand, even the higher end models.

This Krups XP1500 model looks simple, but it looked cheap and very plasticy to me and probably a paint to clean
http://www.lnt.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2094868&cp=1331607.1331947.2469698&view=all&parentPage=family


Next to it, they had a much nicer looking stainless steel unit, the XP2070.

http://www.lnt.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2866368&cp=1331607.1331947.2469698&view=all&parentPage=family

However, I worry about the complexity of using this machine and internet opinions on it range from difficult to use, to breaks within a few months, which is scary considering its $300.

I know nothing about espresso machines other then what i've found out so far. I"ve been to almost every store in my town and the selection is basically the same or worse, so anything else I'd have to order online which I worry about due to not seeing the product for myself and just going via random peoples suggestion but I hate to buy something and just be proven correct by everyone elses review when it breaks early or doesnt work right as it seems the krups are known for.

My mom in very likely hood will use the machine maybe 2-4 times a week, maybe less just depending. She's not a HUGE coffee or espresso fanatic but i'd like to get her something with following MUSTS:

1. Easy to use and operate for a middle aged woman
2. Quality build and construction with ease of cleaning and maintenance
3. Makes a decent cup of coffee/espresso without going overboard on price

Am I basically asking to much from a combo unit? Would I be better to just buy two separate machines and come out ahead in quality vs ease of use? I would really like to stay within the $300 range, $400 is the absolute max we will spend on one.

Thanks for any input, advice, comments or suggestions you can provide

[Cathi]

A quick peek over at Amazon and Coffee Geek at their reviews did not look promising for either of these machines. Have you looked at the Krups Mokka Brew or the Aeropress (there are some monster threads on both of these - good reads)? Neither produces true espresso (the units you mentioned don't either), but instead a very flavorful brew that many swear is espresso-like. I have an Aeropress and it is very simple to use and produces excellent coffee. Of course you could fiddle with it to your hearts content ...... You'll see what I mean if you look at the thread.

The Krups Mokka Brew also has a huge following.

What kind of grinder would you be using?

[Freezebyte]

There will be no grinder, my mom doesn't like to mess with grinding coffee. Just just buys coffee and espresso stuff, lets them sit in the fridge till she's ready, shes not a coffee/espresso connoisseur and more then likely will never become one.

[Cathi]

Seriously? If that's the kind of coffee she enjoys and you don't think she'd be interested in exploring higher quality coffee and preparation, then either of the units you're looking at would probably work well enough for her. There are many reviews at Amazon on differing units that can help you weed out the truly horrible, so it may be worth your time to take a gander. You might also take a look at Consumer Reports and see what they come up with.

Most of the folks here are interested in getting the most out of their coffee and espresso and equipment as they can and don't mind the extra time it takes. Actually I'd say they LOVE all the tweaking, the quirks and complexities.

[Freezebyte]

Ah ok, thats fine but my mom doesn't have time/patience or requirements for such things, she just wants to have a decent cup of coffee and make her espresso's at home again.

Amazingly enough, this little guy at Amazon has been getting good praise at only 1/4 the cost

http://www.amazon.com/Mr-Coffee-ECM21-Espresso-Coffeemaker/dp/B0006ABOAE/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&s=kitchen&qid=1213141507&sr=1-10

This one also looks promising. I check Consumer Reports but they didnt' review many and none of the models are in my town.

http://www.amazon.com/DeLonghi-BCO130T-Combination-Espresso-Machine/dp/B000F2M16O/ref=sr_1_12?ie=UTF8&s=kitchen&qid=1213141507&sr=1-12

[Spresso_Bean]

If she doesn't want to be making espresso with a good machine and grinder, you might want to consider a nice French press like the Bodum Chambord or the other Bodum presses. They're easy to use and can make great coffee for a relatively inexpensive price. For an espresso-esque type of drink you could add on a stovetop moka pot. It's an idea anyway.

[Cathi]

You won't get the best of either with a combo machine and I think that's why you're not getting a lot of response. This site is mostly for espresso enthusiasts or people who want to learn more about espresso and coffee in general. Most of us special order beans from professional roasters or roast our own. Rarely would one purchase supermarket beans and even rarer still pre-ground.

I hope this doesn't come off as preachy, that is not my intention at all. I think its great that you want to do something thoughtful for your mom. If she's happy with the status quo, then try something from a retailer with a good return policy. If your mom is not happy with the product, you can return it.

Personally, I'd recommend an entry level grinder, a melitta pourover cone or french press, and a gift subscription for coffee/espresso to be delivered to your mom.

[jamhat]

I got a Saeco Spidem Villa for my mom at Christmas and she loves it. She and my dad use it every day and like to make drinks for friends with it.

It's a super-automatic machine, so it does all the work for you. Granted, it will not make the very best espresso, but I think for many people it's perfectly fine.

Here are a couple of links for reputable online retailers:
http://www.wholelattelove.com/Sae...o_spidem_villa.cfm
http://www.1st-line.com/machines/...resso_machines.htm

Good luck!
Jamhat

[HB]

As others have said, this site caters to mid-to-high end espresso equipment. But we've all got to start somewhere, so let me offer some general advice:

• The Aeropress is an economical solution; it will make dramatically better brew than the steam powered models you cited (DeLonghi BCO130T, Mr. Coffee ECM21, etc.). Practically everyone has owned a "steam toy" at one point in their espresso journey; these units blast steam and boiling water through the coffee, assuring a bitter brew.
  
• Preground coffee is by definition stale coffee. But if convenience is your mom's thing, either go with the Aeropress and a stovetop steamer, or consider capsules/pods like the Nespresso. They're available everywhere including eBay. Williams-Sonoma sells them and has a generous return policy if they don't work out.
  
• If you get a pump-driven espresso machine, it will need a pressurized portafilter ('crema enhancer'). These coffee aerators generate the appearance of crema, which is the most one can hope for from preground coffee.

One parting thought... you may be selling your mom short. My dad was a diehard whirly-blade coffee fan. He didn't think that coffee could go stale if kept in the freezer. One birthday, I bought him a Solis Maestro and a few orders of Intelligentsia Coffee. Today he brags about how great his morning coffee is and his friends rave about his after-dinner coffee. Like my dad, your mom may have a hidden "coffee snob" in her, waiting for someone to awaken it.

[mgwolf]

Hi,
Maybe I missed it somewhere, but does your mom like milk drinks (like lattes and cappucinos) or does she like the espresso/coffee part of it? One possible solution would be a mokka pot, like a Bialetti, that makes quite good espresso like coffee of much better quality than a Krups. There are some models which sort of froth the milk too.

http://www.amazon.com/Bialetti-1%...ref=pd_sbs_k_2_img

http://www.amazon.com/Bialetti-1%...ref=pd_sbs_k_2_img

Two examples. Good luck. Michael

[quar]

I'm going to have to second Dan's pointer toward the Nespresso system. For somebody who just wants an espresso and doesn't want to have to worry about beans, grinders, etc, these machines do an acceptable job. Far better than canned preground or pods.

Mike

[gabriel]

I will third that opinion.
I had a Nespresso machine for few years and was very happy with it
It makes a much better espresso than any steam-toy you can get

Just keep in mind that the capsules are not cheap, I think they are going now for $0.55 each
The machine can be bought for less than $200 (you can use the 20% off coupons for LNT)

The best thing about the Nespresso system that they are so easy to use.

/gabi

[Freezebyte]

Hmmm, good ideas and suggestions, but I dunno if shes going to be into being limited by capsules and what not for those Nespresso machines. I guess I didn't figure that you guys are the hard edge connoisseurs of coffee and espresso while most of us are just fine with the average output. Hell, the expressos and what not done at Starbucks are good enough in my book and I don't drink such things often. I think im just gonna go order a DeLonghi BCO130T at Amazon as it seems to be a pretty good reviewed product for a fair price and easy to use vs the Krups automatic one. Thanks for the input.

[quar]

I wouldn't consider the output of that DeLonghi with preground coffee as average. It'll be very poor. Starbucks isn't average, it's just poor.

That DeLonghi is just a bad choice. If your mom doesn't want to be bothered with doing things right (not that the Nespresso was right, mind you), get her a decent drip machine and a moka pot and be done with it. I'd suggest a Technivorm for drip and a moka pot of your choice. Don't think that the Technivorm is coffee snob conceit, either. My 77 year old dad who spent most of his life drinking whatever was around, actually asked me to help him find one. He has been amazed by the difference.

Mike

[sweaner]

Mike, keep in mind that most people do not drink coffee that is anywhere near as high quality/fresh as everyone here. Yet they seem to enjoy it just the same.

My wife drinks Instant Sanka. She likes it, and that is really all that matters. I suspect the OP's mom will be happy with the machine selected. I can't even imagine my mom using an espresso machine.

[HB]

I think im just gonna go order a DeLonghi BCO130T at Amazon as it seems to be a pretty good reviewed product for a fair price and easy to use vs the Krups automatic one.

That's a dressed-up steam toy. If your mom will be happy with such a setup, you could save almost $100 and get the Mr. Coffee ECM21 for less than $60. It also has lots of "positive" reviews like the one below.

(My review of such a contraption: "Even for free, it's an awful machine for the price!" )

Awesome Machine for the Price!
If you are looking to try your hand at Espresso making and want to save money and space, then this is your baby!

We previously had the entry level Mr Coffee Espresso maker and ran it to death. We had it about 2 1/2years and it was used just about everyday. If you figure the cost of your average Cap, Esp or Latte drink we more than got our money's worth. We made the small additional investment of a thermometer and frothing cup just to make the job easier. Never having made anything more than regular coffee, this is a great machine to learn on.

Anyway, we finally killed it, and decided to replace it and our previous coffee maker with this combo machine which takes up less space

[RapidCoffee]

Although H-B may not be the best site for your question, you've received some good advice nonetheless. Let me offer one more recommendation to ignore : avoid DeLonghi coffee brewers. If you're absolutely determined to get your mom a dual coffee-"espresso" brewer, choose one of the Krups or Mr. Coffee models instead. Based on my admittedly limited experience with DeLonghi products, even their drip brewers don't come close to producing correct brew temps.

EDIT: Apologies for the cross posting. Great minds etc.

[Spresso_Bean]

There are refurbished KitchenAid Pro Line espresso machines this week at the KitchenAid site for a little over $200 shipped, and those supposedly have Gaggia internals. They can also use pods if necessary, so that could be another option with KitchenAid having great support. These were originally quite expensive compared to the current prices.

http://www.shopkitchenaid.com/product_detail.asp?HDR=outlet&T1=KTA+RKPES100NP&.

[quar]

I loved to look at my KA Pro-Line...Just hated to use it. It is a Gaggia on the inside (some on the outside too, PF, etc.), but it wasn't reliable at all. I only used my for about 7 months and had to have the whole machine replaced twice. While a beautiful machine with decent quality internals, it suffered from some poor design choices. My steam and hot water buttons kept slipping inside the machine. Seems that the bit that held them against the front of the machine was prone to slipping.

$200 is a great price, when they sold for $899 new. I'd just be afraid the buttons weren't fixed yet. I ended up selling mine for more than I paid for it (I got a very good deal through Amex Wishlist that x-mas) and moved on to the Anita.

Mike

[Spresso_Bean]

I was just thinking the KitchenAid might be better than a Delonghi or something similar.