Is Joe Glo safe to use in La Pavoni Professional?

[robertjstone]

I just bought a new La Pavoni Professional and purchased some Joe Glo to keep it clean, but the warning on the package about making sure your machine is OK for Joe Glo and backflushing etc. has me concerned.

I would appreciate if someone could confirm for me that I can use Joe Glo, and also whether I use it like the cleaning product supplied with the machine - ie. dissolving it in warm water, cycling through the machine as normal from the boiler, then doing the same with fresh water to rinse.

Many thanks for any advice you have!

[cannonfodder]

Sort of. JoeGlo is a wonderful detergent cleaner, but a laPav does not have a 3way solenoid so it can not be back flushed. I don't know of any lever that has a 3way actually. You can use it, but only on disassembly of the machine. You can remove the shower screen and group piston and soak them in JoeGlo to clean them on occasion. You should NOT put it in the boiler. There is no reason to put it in there because there nothing in the boiler that it would clean. You can soak your portafilter and baskets in it to clean them up.

JoeGlo is detergent, not a descale/delime agent. To remove scale from the boiler (the white residue that builds up in the sight glass) you need a descale agent. They are two different cleaners for two different jobs, neither of which need done very often. I descale and clean the piston/shower screen about twice a year but I am not a heavy lever user.

[robertjstone]

Thanks for the advice. So I guess I should use Cleancaf to remove the scale by drawing it through the system from the boiler, and just use Joe Glo to clean the removable parts?

[maurice]

But would it actually be harmful to put JoeGlo, or Cafiza, in the boiler and flush it out through the group?

I have an old europiccolo which can't be disassembled (one of the bolts on the front is fused and even my local Pavoni service centre say they won't risk trying to open it). So my only chance of cleaning the innards is to flush the cleaner through from the boiler. Is that likely to be damaging?

[robertjstone]

The instructions in the box have you running a cleaning solution of some sort through from the boiler prior to first use - I figured cleancaf would be the same thing...?

[cpl593h]

JoeGlo is great when ran through the boiler - I used to do it all the time to clean the brew path. It's a detergent that doesn't leave residue, but the boiler and should be flushed out about three times after you run the detergent through. If you do this often, though, you'll have to lubricate your piston gaskets often too.

[HB]

JoeGlo is great when ran through the boiler...

Are you referring to this?

"The Amazing Backflush Detergent"

Their website says:

Joeglo is an amazing, premium quality commercial espresso machine backflush detergent. It quickly and completely removes residual coffee oils, odors and flavors from your group heads, lines and valves. JoeGlo even contains a water softener to help prevent scale buildup.

Use JoeGlo to mix up an amazing "Wicked Liquid" soaking solution. Cleans and deodorizes your portafilters, screens, shot glasses and utensils in record time. Use it to clean out your glass pots, airpots, urns, thermos' and steam pitchers. JoeGlo also works wonders crusty steam wands. Just soak them for a couple of minutes and Bam!, they're clean. Do a side by side soaking comparison against any other brand of espresso machine cleaner and you'll see why so many top baristas prefer JoeGlo.

I see nothing about boilers. Cleancaf is citric acid and some mild detergent. Espresso machine cleaners for backflushing a quite a bit stronger using trisodium phosphate (see JoeGlo's Materials Safety Date Sheet for precise ingredients). I suppose it wouldn't matter with a good rinsing, but my preference is to use ingestible cleaners (or nearly ingestible) for the boiler, e.g., citric acid or vinegar. The same advice for Cafiza and Purocaff.

[kbuzbee]

Couldn't agree with you more, Dan.... Does this statement from Joe Glo concern you??

Unusual Fire and Explosion Hazards: DECOMPOSES UNDER HIGH HEAT CONDITIONS TO LIBERATE OXYGEN.

it was on your last link. I have this vision of it increasing boiler pressure..... Wouldn't really hurt anything, I suppose.....

Also, what's with that 'softens water' claim?? I must leave SOMETHING behind to do that, no??


Ken

[rawman]

I was searching for information and found this thread so figured I'd bring it back to life. I recently got a La Pavoni Europiccola. I had been searching for a Cremina but hadn't found one when I saw that the La Pavonis were on sale at Williams Sonoma for $299 I figured I'd get one and see if I could do anything with it. Still want the Cremina but that's another story.

So first I read the instructions, and I see that they say: Remove the coffee descaler enclosed and pour into a 10 or 12 oz coffee mug add hot water, stir, and pour into the boiler. But what they included wasn't descaler, it's Urnex Cafiza. I didn't think it was a good idea, and after reading this thread confirmed it. So any idea why they include it? And, more importantly, is it ok to just run some lemon juice through for now, since I don't have any real descaler? Any ideas why they suggest descaling it before first use?

Thanks in advance.. Jon R.

[ntwkgestapo]

So first I read the instructions, and I see that they say: Remove the coffee descaler enclosed and pour into a 10 or 12 oz coffee mug add hot water, stir, and pour into the boiler. But what they included wasn't descaler, it's Urnex Cafiza. I didn't think it was a good idea, and after reading this thread confirmed it. So any idea why they include it? And, more importantly, is it ok to just run some lemon juice through for now, since I don't have any real descaler? Any ideas why they suggest descaling it before first use?

Thanks in advance.. Jon R.

Jon, I ran a teaspoon or so of good old Arm & Hammer Baking Soda thru my Gaggia Factory (a La Pav Pro clone) before first use. Urnex shouldn't hurt, but baking soda works just fine. My GUESS is to remove any residual oils, etc left over from manufacturing and test. I did the baking soda flush and then flushed the boiler and brew group 3 times with clean water before first use.

I have some fairly hard water where I live so I will be using a bit of citric acid to descale (probably in the next few weeks. about 2 months of use).

Hope this helps!

EDIT: IF you DO decide to use the Urnex Cafiza, make SURE you flush the boiler and brew group WELL. I'd do at least 3 flushes with clean water and might be a bit anal and do 5-6....

[danno]

Good timing on this thread. I have never seen a solid answer as to which are good cleaners and descalers for lever machines. So I'll ask the obvious:

1 - What is a good descaler for a lever machine?
2 - What is a good through-boiler cleaner for a lever machine?

I used Durgol in my Cremina once thus far and it seemed to descale well enough. Haven't done much else, though.

[rawman]

Jon, I ran a teaspoon or so of good old Arm & Hammer Baking Soda thru my Gaggia Factory (a La Pav Pro clone) before first use. Urnex shouldn't hurt, but baking soda works just fine. My GUESS is to remove any residual oils, etc left over from manufacturing and test. I did the baking soda flush and then flushed the boiler and brew group 3 times with clean water before first use.

I have some fairly hard water where I live so I will be using a bit of citric acid to descale (probably in the next few weeks. about 2 months of use).

Hope this helps!

EDIT: IF you DO decide to use the Urnex Cafiza, make SURE you flush the boiler and brew group WELL. I'd do at least 3 flushes with clean water and might be a bit anal and do 5-6....

No worries on using the Cafiza. I have no intentions of doing that. I am thinking of just running it with water a few times, it's not like I have any hopes that the first few shots will be drinkable anyway