Help on Cappuccino Amore - Page 3

[timo888]

I meant the fabrication of dispersion screens. Was this the 30-ton press you mentioned back when the trees had leaves?

[espressme]

I meant the fabrication of dispersion screens. Was this the 30-ton press you mentioned back when the trees had leaves?

YUP but 20ton! Might do so if there is the interest, I don't need one right now.

I am leary from past experience of trying to satisfy someone and ending up with a lot of cost that I never recover. I had two different model shops over the years and lost both to deadbeat inventors / corporate purchasing agents that ran up bills and who's lawyers offered 10¢ on the dollar. Had a few bad experiences with the home shop too.

The real cost would be to buy enough of the necessary perforated stainless steel sheet of the proper thickness with holes of the correct diameter. Seems it used to be about $40 a Square foot.This method of manufacture would be only for "all mesh" snap on / in screens. Like the oldest laPav and Amore and some like that. Seems that Caravel and other home machines used that type too. Some just cut to size and snapped into a groove..

At a later date other types could be laser punched and cut after proof of concept, if the cost wasn't too exorbitant. The cost I would have is turning the core to form around and or/ into of steel. Measure and cut oversize and then trim by steps to get the desired end product after springback when removed from the form. Figure about 6 tries per screen = 1ft²or more.

Kinda -sorta like your problem with the different sizes of Cremina baskets and their different fit from different dates or supplier of manufacture, the tooling wore and it is cheaper to change the PF - CNC machining code to fit the baskets.

Remember, sheet metal stretches and retracts so it does not really ever follow the exact size and shape of the core or die used to produce it. So, it is not cut and dried like making a shaped bar stock piece to measure with ones own shop measuring equipment on the lathe.

I suppose that the method could save a few classics from the scrap heap though?
richard

[timo888]

I am leary from past experience of trying to satisfy someone and ending up with a lot of cost that I never recover. I had two different model shops over the years and lost both to deadbeat inventors / corporate purchasing agents that ran up bills and who's lawyers offered 10¢ on the dollar. Had a few bad experiences with the home shop too.

I worked years ago for a prominent plaintiffs firm that specialized in securities class action. On one class action, thousands of investors had lost their life savings because of some nefarious dealings by the directors of the company. The plaintiffs firm worked out a deal with the defense firm (after they had both milked the cow) whereby the class members would be compensated 11 cents on the dollar. The court praised the plaintiffs firm for its excellent efforts on behalf of the class.

Regards
Timo

[bobpaule]

Recently I have developed a problem where the piston might not come down and seat completely after a full pull. I have to open the steam valve to relieve the pressure and place a large bowl under to piston to catch to water that continues to flow. One way I found to fix this is to spray WD40 on the top of the piston and work it for a few minutes to get it down in to mechinism. This seems to fix the system for a few months.

You need Dow Corning 111 from http://www.mcmaster.com . It is the lube rec'd for Olympias. Beware of other food grade lubes labeled "occasional contact" they will not cut it for levers. H61 if i remember well is the USDA spec for frequent contact and high temp variability.

Hehe your WD40 reminded me of the MadMax movie for some weird reason

[BD7Js]

Hi all and I need help too!

I just purchased an Italianstyle CE-14 C - on the cheap. Plenty of rust and corrosion underneath, but seems to function OK... to a point... I can load water from my purifier, and then turn it on... After a couple minutes the tank is partly heating, and then SURPRISE there is water gurgling out of the air vent on the top rear of the cylinder...

(Thanks to Richard fro the warning on piston removal) So I created a wooden support for the piston, and added a 24" clamp - this lets me compress the cylinder and piston, to allow removal of the lever, and then I can remove the piston and replace the piston as I wish. The V-gaskets are old, and I believe this is the source of the water outpouring...

THEREFORE
- Where have you found the V gaskets available?
- Can you verify the dimensions that I believe I have identified: inside diameter 30mm, outside diameter 47mm, thickness of 5mm...
- Is there something else I should look to fix to stop the small stream of water that exudes from the top?
- Someone mentioned a manual - I would love a copy of a manual, PDF or otherwise...

Does anyone have any other ideas which I shgould be considering?

Thanks all,
Brett

[espressme]

Hello Brett,
IMLTHO, You are on the right track. From your description, there is a good possibility that the "v" rings are damaged. It would pay at the same time to get a seal for around the piston rod at the top of the cylinder.
I would make a call to Edward
click here
He's been around the block and could tell you whether an old LaPav "v"ring set would fit. He also has inexpensive gasket sets to aid the task if you find the Old Ambassador or Europiccola sets will fit!
Another is:
click here
Another possibility used by some restorers is:
click here
They have a lot of seals and such.
Alchemist, Latte Jed,and happytamper, among others,I believe, have one of these models
Remember Timmo's comment about Dow#111from:
click here
Good Luck and may a great cuppa soon follow!
sincerely
richard

[happytamper]

Hi all and I need help too!

I just purchased an Italianstyle CE-14 C - on the cheap. Plenty of rust and corrosion underneath, but seems to function OK... to a point... I can load water from my purifier, and then turn it on... After a couple minutes the tank is partly heating, and then SURPRISE there is water gurgling out of the air vent on the top rear of the cylinder...

(Thanks to Richard fro the warning on piston removal) So I created a wooden support for the piston, and added a 24" clamp - this lets me compress the cylinder and piston, to allow removal of the lever, and then I can remove the piston and replace the piston as I wish. The V-gaskets are old, and I believe this is the source of the water outpouring...

THEREFORE
- Where have you found the V gaskets available?
- Can you verify the dimensions that I believe I have identified: inside diameter 30mm, outside diameter 47mm, thickness of 5mm...
- Is there something else I should look to fix to stop the small stream of water that exudes from the top?
- Someone mentioned a manual - I would love a copy of a manual, PDF or otherwise...

Does anyone have any other ideas which I shgould be considering?

Thanks all,
Brett

Hi,

Congrats on your purchase. I have had my cappuccino amore for a while now and still have not managed to get it going. i have carried the piston head with gaskets around in my car waiting for the chance to find some new gaskets but still have not located any. Even mailed one to Vanelis but never heard from them. this Machine has been just teasing me! One day I am sure it will work again but with the many projects i have, and the numerous working machines I use, I have not rushed it.

If you could get a photo of the orientation of the gaskets on the piston rod i would really appreciate it. When I took the gaskets off mine I forgot to note the orientation. As well, is the piston head on your machine in aluminum and is it corroded? Mine is a mess as you might see in the early pics on this thread.

[BD7Js]

So it's Monday, and I started calling places (Sorry, we don't carry that; Sorry we can't help you; Sorry...) and found that I have an old espresso machine...

I went to McMaster-Carr at http://www.mcmaster.com and found a neat little product called a Buna-N Cup. No this won't make your partner love you more. Except if she loves your espresso... Part number for the product I ordered was 9691K59 at a total shipped outlay of under $8 for a 5-pack.

I went 1/4" ht., 1 1/4 ID, and 1 3/4 OD. These are slightly off my own measurements, but I believe will be close enough for espresso work... They have one a tad larger, and that will be the next purchase (I know I should have bought both, but I am too cheap - it's why I drive 4x to Lowes to buy one saw....)

Orientation of the Buna-N cups:
Lowest opens DOWN, so as to PUSH water down toward your espresso
Upper two open toward each other
SO - Middle one - UP
& - Top one DOWN
The Top prevents water from going UP into the cylinder, then out the airhole, down to the base, into the electronics, and tripping your ground circuit interrupt. The middle one prevents the water from pushing down while the tank is heating. The bottom one is used to properly push water into the coffee, and ultimately into your cup...

Will report back once we complete this step. It's a lot like the game of LIFE...

[espressme]

So it's Monday, and I started calling places (Sorry, we don't carry that; Sorry we can't help you; Sorry...) and found that I have an old espresso machine...
Will report back once we complete this step. It's a lot like the game of LIFE...

You mean?? No original rules and you only find if you win after it's all over?
rp
PS, thanks for the M-C part #.
Bye the way, there will be a dispersion screen needed at the bottom of the group. If it is like the LaPav.Euro it may be held in place by the Group gasket. One type may be snapped into a groove inside the bottom of the Cylinder and held by a ring of copper wire staked into place by four light punch marks at 12-3-6-9 o'clock. If there is a groove around your group cylinder, one type is like the Cremina which takes a formed screen that snaps over the group cylinder.

[BD7Js]

Can anyone post a link to the picture of this dispersion screen? I am interested in seeing it, or better yet, buying a replacement... The screen on mine will need to go around the base of the cylinder, and clip around it. The base of the cylinder is approximately 52mm across, and the scree will have to wrap this...

I am ready for anyone's ideas on this...

[espressme]

Can anyone post a link to the picture of this dispersion screen? I am interested in seeing it, or better yet, buying a replacement... The screen on mine will need to go around the base of the cylinder, and clip around it. The base of the cylinder is approximately 52mm across, and the scree will have to wrap this...
I am ready for anyone's ideas on this...

I take no responsibility for you getting the right part from these people, but you will live and learn.
Did you call Edward? I would guess that your part would be similar to a Millennium 53mm part or similar. All dimensions are necessary. So have a caliper and your part in hand to talk to these folks. Dimension from end of cylinder to the top inside of the group around the cylinder where the gasket goes. Diameter of the outside of the cylinder.
The part may be similar to Europiccola part # 14 &# 15, Talk to the man!
Vanelli's also and
http://sreweb.com/ perhaps their LaPav part #54 &#55
there, Call Domenic @ 817-640-3131 to talk espresso history and possibilities for parts, and For a Parts Order Call Bill @ 817-652-6826
Try Careri Inc., 1012 Oakmead Drive, Arlington, TX 76011-7734
817-652-6826

Send good close up pictures ( six inches) from 3 angles of your group bottom if you have any more questions. I can't read your mind.
richard
PS have ypu done a search here about Ambassador or Europiccola?
PPS bye the way, I had water coming out the same spot because my piston unscrewed from the rod

[BD7Js]

I take no responsibility for you getting the right part from these people, but you will live and learn.
Did you call Edward? I would guess that your part would be similar to a Millennium 53mm part or similar. All dimensions are necessary. So have a caliper and your part in hand to talk to these folks. Dimension from end of cylinder to the top inside of the group around the cylinder where the gasket goes. Diameter of the outside of the cylinder.
The part may be similar to Europiccola part # 14 &# 15, Talk to the man!
Vanelli's also and
http://sreweb.com/ perhaps their LaPav part #54 &#55
there, Call Domenic @ 817-640-3131 to talk espresso history and possibilities for parts, and For a Parts Order Call Bill @ 817-652-6826
Try Careri Inc., 1012 Oakmead Drive, Arlington, TX 76011-7734
817-652-6826

Send good close up pictures ( six inches) from 3 angles of your group bottom if you have any more questions. I can't read your mind.
richard
PS have ypu done a search here about Ambassador or Europiccola?
PPS bye the way, I had water coming out the same spot because my piston unscrewed from the rod

Thanks Richard!

I called Edward - no parts...

I will follow up with everyone mentioned here, and will see what we find.

Do you have pictures of the screen on yours? I can certainly take some pics on mine, and will do so...

I measured across the face of the underside - well I formed a mask with foil, then measured the mask - seems pretty accurate - 52mm... Calipers? Yeah I was thinking of buying some, starting to make more sense to me these days...

Thanks for all the tips. I will post results as they come in...

[bobpaule]

Great news on the cups, BTW BUNA ran the rubber plant at Auschwitz.

[espressme]

Thanks Richard!
I called Edward - no parts...
I will follow up with everyone mentioned here, and will see what we find.
Do you have pictures of the screen on yours? I can certainly take some pics on mine, and will do so...
I measured across the face of the underside - well I formed a mask with foil, then measured the mask - seems pretty accurate - 52mm... Calipers? Yeah I was thinking of buying some, starting to make more sense to me these days...
Thanks for all the tips. I will post results as they come in...

Hi Brett,
I do not have a machine of your exact type and have been trying figure out which one you have and sending you to threads that may pertain. I need photos, because there are four screen types that I know of.
Try harbor freight® for a useful, cheap! electronic caliper. hereand here
I would suggest ordering by phone to reduce future spam! If you have a local store, they will meet the catalog prices.
richard

[BD7Js]

So it's Monday, and I started calling places (Sorry, we don't carry that; Sorry we can't help you; Sorry...) and found that I have an old espresso machine...

I went to McMaster-Carr at http://www.mcmaster.com and found a neat little product called a Buna-N Cup. No this won't make your partner love you more. Except if she loves your espresso... Part number for the product I ordered was 9691K59 at a total shipped outlay of under $8 for a 5-pack.

I went 1/4" ht., 1 1/4 ID, and 1 3/4 OD. These are slightly off my own measurements, but I believe will be close enough for espresso work... They have one a tad larger, and that will be the next purchase (I know I should have bought both, but I am too cheap - it's why I drive 4x to Lowes to buy one saw....)

Will report back once we complete this step. It's a lot like the game of LIFE...

WELL - ouch. I put the BUNA-N gaskets in, and they're a little small and a little soft. I will try the 5/16th version, next size up, at another $8 fee.

I fear the bigger ones will be too soft as well... drat drat drat. BUT I will try. I will also ask MC if they have similar gaskets in appropriate size of a stiffer material...

IF you have the ITALIANSTYLE, please DO NOT buy the gaskets I previously recommended, they are too soft and too small... This is very important as the gaskets' role is to keep the water in the tank until the lever raises...

[peacecup]

Brett,

If you happen across a spare portafilter I could use one. I have the brass version - a restoration project, though I'm thinking of selling her instead. It heats up and holds water until the lever is depressed - seems like it might work once I get the PF. It does have the dispersion screen if I can be of any help with that -

PC

[peacecup]

I just posted my CA for sale on the CG buy-sell forum.

PC

[bobpaule]

OK, here we go:

My machine is the semicylindrical brass/copper Enrico aka Italianstyle CE-12C

PF size: 68mm

PF gasket original dimensions: .13" (1/8 ) x 2.4" x 3.2"

Closest match (albeit thicker): http://www.mcmaster.com part ID 5345K16

Piston size: 2"

Piston U-Cups (x3) original dimensions: .28" (9/32) x 1.6" x 2"

Closest match (based on earlier post re 1/4" failure and hoping it will stretch so it will lose height and thin a bit): http://www.mcmaster.com part ID 9691K61 .

A primer on materials, Buna-N or Nitrile is the specification for heat endurance, A60 is the medium rigidity, follow these by height x ID x OD if you custom order. Sadly companies i tried want big orders (1000 plus), kudos to McMaster for trying.

Electrical switch was broken, found 20 mm x 25 mm or so on ebay, pack of 4, lemme know if you need one. Model number is RR212N. See pic below.


Used a lot of lube to make piston move after citric acid descale, Dow Corning 111 http://www.mcmaster.com Part ID 1204K32 .

Tip for tamper, NOS Wiseco Piston Kawasaki KDX200 86-96 68mm 597P8 , see pic below, and look who will land on top

Grabbed piston with rubber mat and pliers and and started twisting, unscrewed easily, came down half way and stopped due to calcificates on cylinder, scaped them, ketchuped it, zinc brushed it and luber her up until she gave in and came , using gentle persuasion with a rubber mallet on the shaft from above (sounds like a script hehe).

Hate to have to say this, but had no choice, grabbed the faithful Dremel tool and took the grinder to the walls to scrape off the oxides, the went 200 and 400 grit, then polishing paste, oh yeah baby i glide my finger like on melted butter inside that cylinder.

Bakelite parts got Lexol plastic conditioner (my Volvo loves it too) and the rubbers (gasket seals) got Michelin tire care marinades for one hour (restore those old S-S bridges).


Tip: the boiler cap will benefit greatly from a fatter gasket. It now slides smoothly and does not need to be forced shut. You find these in kits of all sizes (O-rings) at hardware stores. Also, while at i pushed a screwdriver into the OPV (overpressure valve) and let a drop of Marvel Mistery Oil (Autozone, two stroke radio control engines love it) into each opening, then played with the spring until it looked lubed.

Boiler now looks like factory after about three citric acid one hour hot baths. Got MAAS polishing compound, will follow it with Woodcraft Brass Lacquer, any better tips from restorers?

This should not be done at home. Only qualified technicians should perform above listed operations. This should not be interpreted as encouragement to do the same at home. Do this at own risk.

[bobpaule]

Hi Brett,
I do not have a machine of your exact type and have been trying figure out which one you have and sending you to threads that may pertain. I need photos, because there are four screen types that I know of.
Try harbor freight for a useful, cheap! electronic caliper. here and here
I would suggest ordering by phone to reduce future spam! If you have a local store, they will meet the catalog prices.
richard

I vouch for those calipers, mine looks identical and it is made by Tchibo (like the coffee in EU, even has the steaming bean logo) of Hamburg and was sent to me as a present years ago. Love it, the instant standard/metric conversion is great, i'm a decimal head by breeding

An improvement is found on this model. You can lock the readout without having to twist the screw:

http://www.littlemachineshop.com/...tID=1758&category=

[espressme]

Hello Bob,
Thanks for the ideas. I've emailed you for a switch after getting four types that don't quite work! The photo was good enough that I could read the schematic! My machine has the same inner cylinder problem after descaling. Some pits that I haven't quite come to terms with ...Yet. The switch will put the project closer to the front of the list. The machine did do a fair job of making Very STRONG coffee. And it had a lot of steam available!
Back to Brett's concern;
It seems he has the smaller model of machines. Two Amore types, LeCara, and a couple others. With the proper information a dispersion screen can be fabricated. Or located. Perhaps, as he seems to say, A Cremina type screen might fit his type. Or a ring cut from a basket if for the inside type. And if nothing else, I might try making one with the hydraulic press.
Have a great cup!
richard