Do most plumb-in machines require external pressure?

[zeromike]

Sorry if this has been covered, I wasn't sure what to search for

So I'm in the market for a new machine, and I've been restricting my search to pour-over machines because I won't be able to do a true plumb job for a few years. My question is, do most plumb in machines require external pressure? Which ones can be used with just a hose and a 5 gallon jug?

Thanks

[Balthazar_B]

I'm not sure any will work with just a hose and a 5 gal carboy. But if you add a FloJet to provide adequate pressure, the jug idea will work fine.

[zeromike]

so expensive :\

[RapidCoffee]

so expensive :\

Expensive compared to what? The cost of replacing the pump on your espresso machine?

I ran my plumbed NS Oscar (vibe pump) off an external water bottle for several months without a FloJet. It worked fine, although it ran more quietly once plumbed in (presumably due to the external water line pressure). However, my Rancilio L7 (older one group commercial model, rotary pump) would not run correctly from a bottle. The problem appeared to be the autofill rather than the pump per se, although rotary pump output pressure does depend on input line pressure.

My 2 cents: reconsider your plumbing options. If you are near a water line, even something as simple as an icemaker kit from a local hardware store will work (although adding a pressure regulator and water filter/softener is a good idea).

Although some have run plumbed machines in carts off bottles w/o FloJets, others who should know (Chris Nachtrieb) have indicated this is not recommended. If you really can't plumb in your machine, consider a FloJet as good cheap (~$100) insurance for an expensive investment. Personally, I'd be more concerned with the additional noise of the external pump than the expense.

[zeromike]

Thanks Rapid, thats sound advice

My issue is that I know I will be living in at least 4 different places this year (for >2 months each)... (college)

I think I'll go with a pourover for now. That paired with my uncertainty of having 20amp access narrows my machine choices significantly... down to 5

Isomac Mondiale
Bezzera BZ02S
Ala di Vittoria La Valentina
Andreja Premium
Grimac Mia


or maybe Chris's new machine if it ever shows

[stumo]

Sorry if this has been covered, I wasn't sure what to search for

So I'm in the market for a new machine, and I've been restricting my search to pour-over machines because I won't be able to do a true plumb job for a few years. My question is, do most plumb in machines require external pressure? Which ones can be used with just a hose and a 5 gallon jug?

Thanks

If you can't plumb and you don't want to invest in a FloJet, can you at least place the water source above machine level? Most pumps will push much better than suck. Having gravity on your side may help.

Stu

[Balthazar_B]

so expensive :\

You can get a FloJet for $115. Compared to what you'll probably be spending on a plumbed-in machine, that's really pretty minor, no? And it's not as if you throw it away when you finally plumb-in your machine; you can either sell it or use it for other things. Frankly, so long as you're willing to have the water bottle nearby, the advantage of having an automatic water supply, as opposed to having to fill the machine constantly (well, every three or four days) is worth the cost (IMHO).

Having used both types of machine (pourover and plumbed-in), I'd never go back.

[HB]

Also see the thread Flojet and rotary pump questions. The Procon pump is spec'd at a six foot vertical lift, so presumably a check valve would suffice (to prevent the water from draining out and introducing air bubbles). That said, I would double-check with the vendor before buying because the manufacturer may call out positive pressure, as was the case for the Elektra A3.


Ball-type check valve assures water flows only one direction

[cannonfodder]

I know of a LM that is fed from static bottles with no problem.

[chris]

You can run pretty much any rotary pump machine without line pressure and simply pull water from the jug with a check valve. However you will shorten the life of your pump and you will void your warranty in most cases. Without a constant line pressure your pumps output pressure will not be constant either. It's not just about can you do this or can you do that it's about what are the consequences. My car can go well over 100 miles per hour but I don't make a habit of driving it that fast.

[cannonfodder]

Good to know. I was debating on jug feeding my machine after I finish the rebuild or plumb it in. Plumbing is relatively easy when you have your own home, much more difficult with an apartment or dorm.

100mph, that is third gear on my bike (I have 6 gears), I drive too fast to worry about my cholesterol.

[barry]

If you are near a water line, even something as simple as an icemaker kit from a local hardware store will work

it's not advised. the water line is too small to adequately feed the pump.

[barry]

Without a constant line pressure your pumps output pressure will not be constant either.

zero input pressure seems pretty constant to me... better than unregulated line pressure in that regard.

[RapidCoffee]

it's not advised. the water line is too small to adequately feed the pump.

Agreed. 3/8" would be better, but 1/4" works fine with some pumps (my Oscar came with 1/4" tubing). The flow rate capacity of 1/4" tubing should easily exceed the pump rate through the brew group. But it's probably not as simple as that...

[barry]

The flow rate capacity of 1/4" tubing should easily exceed the pump rate through the brew group. But it's probably not as simple as that...

yes, but when the boiler fill kicks in, the pump may cavitate.