Buyer's Guide to the Vibiemme Domobar Super

[cannonfodder]

In the world of home espresso machines, few features are more prominently recognizable than the E61 grouphead. The market has been flooded with such a variety of machines designed around the E61 group that choosing one has almost become a flip of the coin. Your choices are dominated by similar shiny stainless steel boxes, 1.5 liter boilers and 2 liter water reservoirs. Finding a machine that stands out among the sea of stainless steel isn't easy.

1st-Line hopes its new offering, the Vibiemme Domobar Super, will differentiate itself from its peers in the market's E61-based machines. It sports features like:

• Original E61 grouphead (more on that later),
• Stainless or black powder coat housing,
• Semi-automatic and electronic (automatic) volumetric dosing,
• Three position power switch,
• 2.7 liter boiler and a huge 3.8 liter water reservoir.

An impressive list of options, but are they enough to make the Vibiemme stand out in the crowd? More importantly, does it make good espresso and meet the demanding expectations of the discerning home barista? Over the coming weeks we will poke, prod, measure, and taste in pursuit of answers to these questions. You are also invited to pose your own questions as we push the boundaries of this 70 pound tank called the Vibiemme Domobar Super.


Image courtesy of 1st-Line

[cannonfodder]

The Vibiemme arrived at the house within a couple of days of shipping from 1st-Line. The machine is well packed in its heavy cardboard box from Vibiemme. That box is then re-boxed in a larger one with ample Styrofoam packing to keep things safe in transit. The machine tips the scales at 70 pounds, a light weight this is not. It would be advisable to have an extra body present to assist with unpacking.

Once out of the box, there are relatively few things to do. The stainless steel feet must be screwed onto the base of the machine, remove the cup warmer protective film and put it on a suitably stable location. Assembly complete.

The Super ships with two portafilters, one double and one single spout, a Faema style double basket, single basket and a blank basket for backflushing. You also get the summary black plastic tamper toy suitable for tossing in a cabinet, and a grouphead brush for cleaning the shower screen and gasket. Make sure you order a proper 58mm tamper with the machine. Then there is the typical, less than informative owners manual. You still need to read it prior to using the machine but as with most espresso machines, it is relatively bland and poorly written.

The Domobar Super, which is home bar super in Italian, needs no water supply or drain line, just a suitable electric outlet. Let me point out that there is a Vibiemme (pronounced "Vee-bee-m-may") Domobar and a Domobar Super, two different models with very different specifications.

The Super is commercial UL rated and requires a 120v outlet capable of delivering 17.5 amps of power to drive the 1600w heating element and a 41W vibratory pump. The Super also has a longer than average electrical cord that measures 7 feet long and extends from under the machine emerging from the center of the undercarriage.



The Super is larger than your average E61 clone home espresso machine. Front to back she measures 20 inches deep (not counting one inch for the drip tray handle), 10-1/2 inches wide and 15-3/8 inches tall. You will want to make sure your cabinet is large enough to hold the machine. The Super also tips the scales at 70 pounds so be careful moving it around.

The unit I received is the black powder coat variant. I must say, it is quite attractive and a nice departure from the all polished stainless machines on the market.



The Super is outfitted with both a boiler pressure gauge and a brew pressure gauge mounted across the top front of the machine; reminiscent of the popular Isomac Tea. There are three indicator lights, one beside the boiler pressure gauge and two beside the brew pressure gauge. The amber light by the boiler gauge illuminates when the heating element is energized. The lights on either side of the brew pressure gauge are for low reservoir water (amber on the left side of the gauge) and power (green on the right side of the gauge).



On the semi automatic and automatic versions of the Super, the brew controls are located across the face of the machine between the two gauges. Our sample machine is the manual, or lever actuated version. The lever is mounted on the right side of the massive E61 grouphead. Earlier I mentioned that the Vibiemme used a real E61 group, a little background information may be helpful at this point.

Vibiemme was formed by a handful of employees from Faema when they fell on hard times and went out of business. The employees purchased the patent to the Faema E61 group. Every machine on the market that uses an E61 style group can trace its lineage back to the group on this machine. While other manufacturers make E61 style groups, VBM holds the patent for the original E61 group design.

The differences between the current market E61 offerings and the group on the Domobar Super is obvious at first glance. The group is massive when compared to most machines. Interestingly enough, the E61 group was patented based on a method of preinfusion and not thermal stability.



Moving on down the machine, the drip tray is a two part design. The tray cover consists of a frame with an expanded stainless steel cover. The mesh is spot welded to the stainless frame and provides plenty of space. The mesh is relatively fine; as a result it initially wanted to hold water. After a little use that tendency was diminished, but using a slightly larger mesh expanded steel would improve the flow through the surface of the drip tray cover. The drip tray itself is quite spacious. The two piece design allows you to leave the cover attached to the machines frame and simply remove the drip tray like a drawer. Grasp the drip tray handle and pull it out to empty.



The Vibiemme Domobar Super has dedicated steam wand and water dispenser. Both are outfitted with a ball joint which gives you a large range of motion. The wands are fitted into a valve assembly that angles out from the front of the machine at about a 60 degree angle. While giving you two axes of movement, there is a limitation. The wands will make contact with the valve assembly when moving them out to the sides of the machine. This is a relatively minor issue given the range of motion. The steam wand is capped with a large two hole tip while the water dispenser sports an aerator.



The Domobar Super is a reservoir, or pour over machine. Located under the cup warmer and at the rear of the machine is one of the largest water reservoirs I have ever seen. This machine holds a whopping 3.8 liters of water. The reservoir has an enclosed top with a removable refill cap to prevent anything from falling into the water. The pump pickup tube has a screen tip to prevent any sediment from being drawn into the system. The over pressure valve (OPV) return line also feeds into the reservoir.



The water reservoir sits atop a spring loaded stainless steel plate. Under that plate is a switch. When the reservoir get low, the springs will push the plate up and trip the pressure switch under it killing power to the pump and heating element. When that happens, the amber light to the left of the brew pressure gauge will illuminate. The 3.8 liter capacity provides plenty of water. I have pulled six back to back doubles along with steaming over 30 ounces of milk and the tank was only half empty. You will have to remove the cup warmer to refill the reservoir. Thankfully, Vibiemme put raised handles on the cup warmer so it can be removed without having to take everything off of it.

[harris]

Great start to the review. Although I would llike to jump forward and read the last chapter, I will be patient.

Will you be comparing it to your new toy, the Elektra?

Thank you for taking the the time to write this,


h

[edwa]

I too thank you for the time invested to write this, my brow breaks into a sweat remembering how much time it took me to put together the "Fiorenzato Volante, A Second Look" thread. I stopped by 1st-Line's booth at the Long Beach convention and saw the Vibiemme machine in person. I was struck not only by its size but how quiet it was pulling a shot. I hope you will be reviewing its heat stability.

[Wescott]

The pressure gauges are nicely placed for checking during a pull. So far as I recall, only the Isomac prosumer series uses a similar panel angled up for the gauges. Checking the gauges on most machines--especially if you are tall--is a nuisance. Since the brew pressure gauge on the Vibiemme offers easily readable information during the pull, could you say what, if anything, of value comes from consulting that gauge.

In other words, what does the brew pressure measurement tell you about the shots?

And I join the majority in thanking you for your willingness to take this on, Cannonfodder. It's not the first time either. Your series on dialing in the Elektra was illuminating.

[cannonfodder]

Great start to the review. Although I would llike to jump forward and read the last chapter, I will be patient.

Will you be comparing it to your new toy, the Elektra?

Thank you for taking the the time to write this,


h

I may at some point but I do not want to muddy the waters and turn it into a machine A vs machine B shootout. At the conclusion of the official buyers guide we do try to put a ranking scale to the machines performance in comparison to its peers.

As to the last chapter, it has not been written yet, nor has the middle. These bench reviews take a minimum of a couple months of machine usage, testing, measuring logging etc to complete. Right now we are at the very beginning of the process. It will progress over the next few weeks. We have to make sure our data is accurate and review thorough and still work our day jobs.

[HB]

These bench reviews take a minimum of a couple months of machine usage, testing, measuring logging etc to complete. Right now we are at the very beginning of the process.

I also have the Vibiemme in house and will help with color commentary. Our "tag team" approach assures consistency of the final Buyer's Guide and shares the research burden. In addition to the usual research and measurements, we'll have a couple surprises along the way, like this piece of E61 eye candy:


Copyright Ian Stewart (woodchuck), please do not copy

[cannonfodder]

I too thank you for the time invested to write this, my brow breaks into a sweat remembering how much time it took me to put together the "Fiorenzato Volante, A Second Look" thread. I stopped by 1st-Line's booth at the Long Beach convention and saw the Vibiemme machine in person. I was struck not only by its size but how quiet it was pulling a shot. I hope you will be reviewing its heat stability.

It is a big machine. I did not realize how small and boxy my Isomac Millennium was until I put the Vibiemme beside it.

I do have a few gadgets in the toolkit but Dan has the uber tech kit with pressure transducers multi data loggers and a Vibiemme as well. He will be chiming on occasion with his measurements.

[cannonfodder]

what, if anything, of value comes from consulting that gauge.

In other words, what does the brew pressure measurement tell you about the shots?

The angled top does make it easier to see the gauges. I am somewhat vertically challenged but they are still easier to view than the gauges on most machines.

As to the brew pressure gauge usefulness during a shot, it is relatively minimal. If your dose/distribution/grind is off you will see it in the gauge but the lack of espresso flow, or the blond gusher, is just as accurate of an indicator. Most gauges are there just as a point of reference especially since most machines don't have super accurate gauges. They tend to be more a set it and forget it when it comes to brew pressure. If you do not have a brew pressure gauge, then you have to rig up a portafilter mounted gauge to adjust your pump pressure. I do use the boiler gauge and watch it during a shot. I watch it to make sure I hit the extraction at the top of the heat cycle.

[cannonfodder]

I measured out the drip tray capacity this evening. According to my super accurate Pyrex two cup kitchen measure, it holds 1.8 liters of water. That is filled to the brim, if you don't want to spill water everywhere removing it than a liter is more reasonable.

I have had the machine on for 4 hours now. I was wondering how hot the water in the reservoir gets as well as the cup warmer. The Fluke tells me the water reservoir is 91F and the cup warmer is a toasty 146F.

[cannonfodder]

Once you have the water reservoir filled and power hooked up it is time to power it on and pull some shots.

The Domobar Super is outfitted with a three position power switch. You normally only find these in commercial machines. In the first (I) position, the system is powered on but the heating element is not yet energized. The pump will prime and start filling the boiler. You can also run water through the heat exchanger and group without engaging the heating element. Given the larger boiler on the Super, the three position switch makes perfect sense. You would not want your heater kicking on before the pump got enough water into the boiler to submerge the heating element.

Once the boiler has filled and you have filled the heat exchanger, you rotate the switch to its final position (II). Once there the heater will kick on and the amber 'element energized' light beside the boiler pressure gauge will illuminate. Now would be a good time to wash out your portafilters and get everything ready. The large boiler and group head take some time to heat. A minimum of 45 minutes is required and an hour is even better.


Off (0), pump on (I), pump and heating element on (II)

As with all heat exchanger machines, temperature is controlled via the cooling flush. For more information on flushing techniques please read How I Stopped Worrying and Learned to Love HXs. Once heated, I noticed that the machine took less flushing than I anticipated. Both for the initial cooling flush as well as intra shot cooling. A quick email to Jim at 1st-Line answered the question. The Super has a flow restrictor in the upper thermosyphon line. That keeps the group temperature in check even during extended idle periods. My machines idle group temperature stabilizes at 200F give or take a degree. Even with idle periods in excess of four hours the group never got over 202F according to the thermometer fitted into the grouphead.


Group temperature after 4 hours of idle time

Once everything is heated, it is time to pull some shots. I opened up my fresh bag of Ambrosia from Caffe Fresco and dumped it into the LaCimabli Jr grinder. Set my initial grind point, ground and dosed, pulled my cooling flush, tamped locked in and pulled my first shot. The shot was fast, blond, hot and went down the sink. Now the work begins.

As anyone that owns an espresso machine knows, getting the grind/dose/temperature right takes a few tries. The first challenge is getting the cooling flush correct. While the Super's group holds at a nice 200F thanks to the thermosyphon restrictor, the heat exchanger still need to be flushed. One thing I noticed very quickly was how short the flash boil lasted. My Isomac takes around 10 seconds of flow just to get past the flash boil, the Super only required around 3 seconds to reach the end of the flash boil thanks to the cooler group.

I tried several iterations of the cooling flush, flush and go, flush and recover, short flush short recovery short flush and go. Even with the larger boiler, the Vibiemme required some recovery time according to my taste tests. I settled on an initial 10 second flush post flash boil followed by a 10 second recovery for the Ambrosia blend. I find Ambrosia works best for me at around 201F and my tongue is telling me I am hitting the mark. My boiler is set at 1.1 bar at the top of cycle. I learned very quickly (thanks to my grouphead thermometer) that the Domobar Super requires a very short inter shot cooling flush. If you are fast enough on the grind/dose/tamp you can even forgo the intra shot flush. My thermofilter has not arrived yet so I do not have any temperature profiles to post at this time.

Grind and dose; my brew pressure was running a little high so I was grinding finer than usual. I started with a low dose, around 15 grams. I had mixed results at the lower doses. I incrementally increased my dose until I found what works best for Super and my personal taste. I ended up at 16-17 gram depending on the blend I was using.

So far so good, the shots are still developing as I tune the machine and work out what works best for the Super.


Tight double ristretto

[cannonfodder]

My brew pressure was running a little on the high side, over 10 bar. I pulled the covers off this evening and made a small pressure change. It is just under 9 bar now. When you change one variable, you have to compensate by changing several others. Reducing the brew pressure required a revisit on the grind and dose settings.

Previously, I was having extraction issues with the higher pressure. I had to grind much finer than normal and was dosing up. I was getting uneven extractions and pitting (channeling) on the puck. I have also changed coffee, which is another major variable change. Right now I am feeding the Super some Black Cat from Intelligentsia Coffee Roasters. I have lowered my dose and coarsened up the grind. With Black Cat, I am dosing 15 grams in the stock double basket and hitting the sweet spot.


Ristretto cappuccino bound

I have noted a drop in pressure when the heating element energizes while pulling a shot. An important note to keep in mind, the Vibiemme Domobar Super was designed as a 220 volt machine and then retrofitted to work on 110 volts. The higher 220 voltage requires less amperage than our 110 volte supply. Although the wiring meets UL standards for the required voltage and amperage, the Super suffers the common side effect of a slight dip in the brew pressure when the heating element kicks in. To counter this, I make sure I start my shots at the top of the boiler cycle. I can usually pull a double shot without the heater turning on.

[Randy G.]

Once you have the water reservoir filled and power hooked up it is time to power it on and pull some shots.

As with all heat exchanger machines, temperature is controlled via the cooling flush. For more information on flushing techniques please read How I Stopped Worrying and Learned to Love HXs. Once heated, I noticed that the machine took less flushing than I anticipated. Both for the initial cooling flush as well as intra shot cooling. A quick email to Jim at 1st-Line answered the question. The Super has a flow restrictor in the upper thermosyphon line. That keeps the group temperature in check even during extended idle periods. My machines idle group temperature stabilizes at 200F give or take a degree. Even with idle periods in excess of four hours the group never got over 202F according to the thermometer fitted into the grouphead.

IIRC, about a year or two ago I read that someone was working on a thermosyphon E-61 with a physical thermostat in the line (bimetallic or?) that would allow or limit the thermosyphon flow based on group temperature. Is this the case here? When originally mentioned it sounded like an elegant and easy solution for the overheating situation. I never heard much about it after that.

[another_jim]

IIRC, about a year or two ago I read that someone was working on a thermosyphon E-61 with a physical thermostat in the line (bimetallic or?) that would allow or limit the thermosyphon flow based on group temperature. Is this the case here? When originally mentioned it sounded like an elegant and easy solution for the overheating situation. I never heard much about it after that.

The GS3 has a thermoplastic valve to control how the water gets preheated. There's a rumor the same style valve (2 way instead of three) is being used on some thermosyphons, in particular the new Expobars. However, I've heard nothing to confirm this. The Domobar apparently has a built in restrictor that keeps the head from overheating, and the flushes much briefer than on other E61s.

[cafeIKE]

The Domobar apparently has a built in restrictor that keeps the head from overheating, and the flushes much briefer than on other E61s.

Nos 61 and 62 No idea what the difference is between 61 and 62.

I'd be curious to try a Thermoplastic valve on another machine.
My limited experience with them is they have a rather leisurely response.

[erics]

The size of the restriction orifice, located at the boiler end of the upper thermosyphon pipe, is 0.110" (2.8 mm) for this Vibiemme as reported here:

http://www.home-barista.com/forum...r-t3939.html#42712

As a matter of interest, the size of a similar restriction orifice optionally(?) fitted to Australian Expobar prosumer machines is 2.5 mm as discussed here:

http://www.home-barista.com/forum...-pulser-t2789.html

I would almost be willing to wager that there exists other prosumer machines with restriction orifices fitted as the above but the only way you would know (for sure) is to do a little disassembly that few of us have undertaken. There are probably a lot of E-61 style machines that don't have them but should have them.

The idea of putting a solenoid valve in the lower thermosyphon line originated here:

http://www.home-barista.com/forum...machines-t787.html

The only problem I have found here is finding a "proper" solenoid valve that could be fitted and, more importantly, retrofitted to a whole bunch of machines. The idea being to end this cooling flush business for good and at a reasonable cost - say ~ $300. Any help in finding a "proper" solenoid valve would be appreciated.

edit: changed the location of Mr. V's restriction orifice as a result of a PM.

[cannonfodder]

I have been thinking about adding a flow restrictor to my Elektra to help control the group temperature. You still need to do a cooling flush because the heat exchanger water is the same temperature as the boiler. However, you are not cooling down a 230F group head which makes the flush shorter.

Think of a washer for a bolt, a plug with a smaller hole in the middle. You essentially have a plug that fits into the thermosyphen at the point the pipe attaches to the grouphead but has a smaller orifice to restrict the flow out of the group, which slows the water into the group, but does not effect the heat exchanger flow during an extraction.

[erics]

Maybe these guys can help:

http://superior.thomasnet.com:80/...ver=1001&forward=1

MAYBE you could use metal but it better be soft stuff to effect a seal.

Now lets get back to that review, CF

[cannonfodder]

OK

[cannonfodder]

The Vibiemme Domobar Super really shines as a steamer. One of the defining points about the Super is that Vibiemme has pushed the standard 1.5 liter boiler to 1.8 liters. That may not sound like much, but sometimes big things come in little packages. That extra 0.3 liters must be packed with steam.

The steam wand is affixed to the left side of the machine via a ball joint. That allows you to move the steam wand in any direction needed. The wand itself appears to be slightly larger than most in diameter. I would have to take my calipers to it to compare it with my Isomac. The wand has a small rubber grip point for moving while hot. Just don't miss, or you will be reminded when you sizzle a couple fingers.



The steam is hot and high velocity, though a little moist compared to the Elektra A3.

[gvideo]http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4776974975526404912[/gvideo]

The steam tip is larger than most and will NOT fit other wand tips. I have an Isomac tip and a Gold Pro two hole tip. The threads on the Super are of a different pitch. While the other tips will start to thread, they bind up after one turn. Personally, I would not recommend changing the tip. It is well matched to the steaming capacity of the machine. It may be a bit fast for a novice user but it creates pitchers of microfoam with next to no effort.

[gvideo]http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1609002093550348065[/gvideo]

The water tap is a shorter version of the steam wand. It uses the same ball joint, same valve but uses a much shorter wand. The end of the water tap is outfitted with an aerator. I can easily dispense 16oz of water and the flow is still going strong. I dumped 16oz of water into a preheated thermal cup to check the temperature. I measured a solid 208F even with that large draw of water. You will have to watch your hands; she is a fire breathing dragon.

When dispensing water from your boiler you need to make sure you do not dispense too much water. If you flush too much water, you could expose your heating element. An energized heater and no water can lead to a blown heating element. The Domobar Super has a 1.8 Liter boiler, which is 60.883 Fluid Ounces; however the boiler is not filled 100% with water. Assume that no more than half the boiler is full of water giving you .9 Liters. That translates to 30.442 Fluid Ounces. I feel confident that dispensing 16oz of water will not lower the water level below the heating element. Keep in mind that while dispensing water, the pump is replenishing the supply.



If milk based drinks are you preference, the Domobar Super will not disappoint.