Brew temperature test equipment

[King Seven]

Apart from the Scace device, what do people recommend by the way of thermometers/loggers/software etc?

And where is good to buy it all from?

Thanks,
James

[Ken Fox]

Apart from the Scace device, what do people recommend by the way of thermometers/loggers/software etc?

And where is good to buy it all from?

Thanks,
James

You should check out Jim Schulman's posts in the Home brew temp thread below for what he would do; he favors a modified Schomer basket with a cheap digital thermometer.

What I would recommend is getting a cheap to moderately priced digital thermometer and a thin K-type thermocouple (like 30 gauge) that can be secured with the group screw; you may have to mount it either below or above the group screen depending on your machine type. Barry Jarrett has posted a picture here on HB of his arrangement using this technique; I think you can find it by searching HB posts. It is somewhere in the Scace Thermofilter thread on "The Bench" forum.

This thermocouple, so mounted, will last for a period of time and then have to be discarded. I think that this method will give more repeatable results than what Jim has suggested, although there will be error introduced by the inexpensive digital thermometer.

ken

[HB]

I have the Fluke model 54 II from Tequipment.net (shop around for prices, they vary considerably). It has two input channels and datalogging. The real ticker about the Flukes is that FlukeView Forms software is required to download data off the meter using infrared, another $150. Omega offers their own in-house thermometers, though the reviews I've read vary from "great deal!" to "pain in the butt interface!"

I ordered thermocouples from Omega, 5SC series, 5SC-TT-36-36 (five pack, mini connection, teflon insulation, type T, 36 gauge, 36" long). You can save money by getting the wire / connectors and making the TCs yourself too (I was lazy and ordered the prefabs).

[malachi]

Fluke 54, Scace.
If you're going to get serious, invest in a datalogger.

[miKe mcKoffee]

I know many people use the Fluke 54. Anyone have any experience with the Thermoworks Digi-Sense DuaLogR Thermocouple Logging Thermometer? Click Here Specs look very similar except it can log 1000 instead of 500 readings, doesn't offer "software" just RS232 interface for use with terminal program.

[Balthazar_B]

There are also these devices, which have been brought up before:

http://www.omega.com/ppt/pptsc.asp?ref=HH506A_HH506RA

Anyone have experience with Omega dataloggers?

[miKe mcKoffee]

There are also these devices, which have been brought up before:

http://www.omega.com/ppt/pptsc.asp?ref=HH506A_HH506RA

Anyone have experience with Omega dataloggers?

No experience but I looked at those and thought the "128 Samples with Real-Time Data" would be too limiting.

[Balthazar_B]

No experience but I looked at those and thought the "128 Samples with Real-Time Data" would be too limiting.

I believe that's its capacity for onboard saved data. If you're logging data, it looks like the device will do more:

"The OMEGA HH506A is a low cost, feature-packed,
portable, digital thermometer that measures K, J, R, S, T, E
and N thermocouples. The unit has datalogging capacity in
the save mode of 128 samples with time stamp via pressing
the save button. In the datalogging mode up to 1024 records
may be logged at an interval set from 1 second to 23 hr/59
min/59 sec. Data is stored in 16 groups of 64 records. Easy
to use set-up instructions allow the user to measure a broad
range of T/Cs, MAX/MIN, AVG, REL, Hold Function, T1/T2.
The HH506RA has the HH506A features plus it includes an
RS232 interface with Windows software."

Of course, you could get a Fluke thermologger instead, for the price of about 3 of these .

[miKe mcKoffee]

No experience but I looked at those and thought the "128 Samples with Real-Time Data" would be too limiting.

I believe that's its capacity for onboard saved data. If you're logging data, it looks like the device will do more:

"The OMEGA HH506A is a low cost, feature-packed,
portable, digital thermometer that measures K, J, R, S, T, E
and N thermocouples. The unit has datalogging capacity in
the save mode of 128 samples with time stamp via pressing
the save button. In the datalogging mode up to 1024 records
may be logged at an interval set from 1 second to 23 hr/59
min/59 sec. Data is stored in 16 groups of 64 records. Easy
to use set-up instructions allow the user to measure a broad
range of T/Cs, MAX/MIN, AVG, REL, Hold Function, T1/T2.
The HH506RA has the HH506A features plus it includes an
RS232 interface with Windows software."

Of course, you could get a Fluke thermologger instead, for the price of about 3 of these .

Actually I was leaning towards the Thermoworks for about 2.8 times more. However, I missed that information you posted about datalogging mode up to 1024 records for the OMEGA, so thanks. Sounds worth looking into further. Need to find out exactly what they mean by 16 "sets" of 64 records. Whether it just means a continous datalogging is broken up into separate record sets or if each event limited to 64 records with total of 16 isolated sessions possible.

[gscace]

I use a Fluke meter when I just wanna look at the number and don't care about logging. I use a picotech TC-08 8 channel thermocouple datalogger for logging. Picotech is an English company. If you're based in the US, Swangate International is a good source. The TC-08 is nice because you can do multiple groups at once, and also log things like boiler and group temps.

I have a project envisioned that's gonna require all 8 channels.

-Greg

[Balthazar_B]

I have a project envisioned that's gonna require all 8 channels.

-Greg

8 channels???!!?? Is one of those from a thermosensor under your tongue?

[lennoncs]

8 channels???!!?? Is one of those from a thermosensor under your tongue?

In the world of dataloggers 8ch is kinda the starting point, I regularly use 10-20 channels on the home projects and 200-300 channels on systems at work.

You need to keep in mind that temperture is not the only thing thatis measured.

Sean

[lennoncs]

8 channels???!!?? Is one of those from a thermosensor under your tongue?

In the world of dataloggers 8ch is kinda the starting point, I regularly use 10-20 channels on the home projects and 200-300 channels on systems at work.

You need to keep in mind that temperature is not the only thing that is measured.

Sean

[HB]

You need to keep in mind that temperature is not the only thing that is measured.

For those who are reading this and thinking "OK, like what?", the epilogue of the Buyer's Guide to the Expobar Brewtus shows one example:

Although I've not rigged something as fancy as this, it's not hard to imagine that knowing precisely when the pump was engaged, heating element turned on, or solenoid X closed would give you a better picture of the system dynamic (not to say that it doesn't boggle my mind too ).

[DavidMLewis]

Actually I was leaning towards the Thermoworks for about 2.8 times more. However, I missed that information you posted about datalogging mode up to 1024 records for the OMEGA, so thanks. Sounds worth looking into further. Need to find out exactly what they mean by 16 "sets" of 64 records. Whether it just means a continous datalogging is broken up into separate record sets or if each event limited to 64 records with total of 16 isolated sessions possible.

Hi Mike,

At the end of the 64 records it rolls over into the next section. With a logging frequency of 1 sample/s, there's no gap. With a frequency of one sample every 2 seconds, there seems to be a three-second gap in the time stamps. I've reverse-engineered the protocol for my own use on a Mac, and have a little Python code that gets the input using a commercial USB/serial driver and massages it appropriately. I'll send them to anybody who asks. The supplied Windows software is cumbersome and buggy.

Best,
David

[barry]

I have a project envisioned that's gonna require all 8 channels.

it's taken you long enough to get there...

i'm using 6 on my 2-group right now, and i've used 8 several times on the 4-group.

i've even thought of getting a second TC08, because if i log all the machine data, then i don't have room for the portafilter data, too!

[lennoncs]

it's taken you long enough to get there...

i'm using 6 on my 2-group right now, and i've used 8 several times on the 4-group.

i've even thought of getting a second TC08, because if i log all the machine data, then i don't have room for the portafilter data, too!

How are you guys measuring things like flow, volume, pressure, pump cycle and heater cycles?

It appears that the Picotech is only a thermocouple device.


Thanks
Sean

[barry]

nah, i need all those channels just for temp.

i haven't got 'round to pressure & flow yet.

[cannonfodder]

And it even makes espresso...

[erics]

Hi David -

Could you elaborate (a few lines) on your statement "The supplied Windows software is cumbersome and buggy."

Have you contacted Omega and gotten their input?

It sure looks like large "bang for the buck"

Much Thanks,

Eric S.