This morning I pulled two doubles, and they were two of the best consecutive doubles I have done in a long, long time. No "sink the first shot" for me! I have a very nice blend and roast, and hit the grind level and it is all just doing great together. Delicious, smooth, sweet, deep, rich.. I could go on. So happy was I, until...

It had been some weeks since I did a thorough cleaning, so after we enjoyed our breakfast and each others company, I decided to give the VBM a cleaning. The usual sort of stuff- pulled the shower screen and dispersion disc, cleaned things all up, and was so happy I even got a bit of jeweler's rouge out and buffed the dispersion brass. Ooo.. Shiny!

I washed out the drip tray and decided that as long as I had some Cafiza mixed I would give the cup rest screen/drip tray cover a scrubbing. While that was off I was wiping out the frame area under the drip tray I heard a rattle and I lifted the towel to find the following:



The drip tray support had come loose. Under it was a terrible amount of rust. It was so bad that it ate through the spot welds, which in the long run was a good thing. These supports are welded before the framework is powder coated, and the area under the support does not receive much coating, and some of the area got none at all. The white speckled area on the floor of the frame, to the left of the rust (looking at the photo) is a partial coating of powered coat. The side of the frame where it turns up from the floor had none at all. Look at the bracket- there is not only heavy rust where the bracket meets the frame's floor, but there is also a large area of rust in the portion that is raised above the floor. The design allows water to accumulate and sit in there causing the rust as you can see. This has only taken about 2½ years to occur. I tried to pry up the other support but it is still firmly attached although I can see some signs of rust there as well. I will probably try to drill out the spot welds to get it off as well.

I am in the process of cleaning this area up and repainting it. My current plan is to drill and tap holes so that the bracket can be more easily removed so that the area can be cleaned. Off to get some metric stainless steel hardware...

If you have a black VBM I suggest that you check this area out before it gets this far into rustland. Maybe some rust-converting primer sprayed or poured into that area- maybe just a monthly shot of WD-40 or similar.. If you are thinking about buying one, I HIGHLY suggest getting one of the stainless steel models, if the black is even still a choice for the model you are considering. I see that at 1st-Line that most of the models only come in stainless now, and only one is shown in black..

You may remember that one of my early criticisms of the VBM was that the drip tray design allowed water to get under the tray. Some members here stated that it did not happen to them, it should now be clear that it is a problem, and here is the result of that. VBM seemed to also believe it was a problem, and their response was to put a bend in the backsplash panel to deflect water that is sprayed against that area into the tray. This still does not address the fact that water accumulating in an area that is not properly protected from moisture and corrosion is not accessible to the owner.

I tried to get a stainless Domobar Super manual when I got my machine but it was not available to me. Darn.... Here is the result. I am not a happy camper over this. A +/- $1700 espresso machine should not exhibit this sort of thing in its life, let alone in less than three years of use, which 90%+ of the time is two morning doubles then the machine is turned off for the rest of the day.

Bummer. Unfortunately, you can't turn off rust; it doesn't care if you are making 200 shots 24/7 or 5 shots at 4 hours a day.

Is the part that is rusting part of a single frame for the whole machine, like on most espresso machines, or can it be removed from the main body and replaced?

another_jim wrote:Is the part that is rusting part of a single frame for the whole machine, like on most espresso machines, or can it be removed from the main body and replaced?

The base showing the rust is the bottom of the entire framework, and to deal with it more directly (chrome or powder coat) I would have to disassemble the entire machine.

I am thinking about a redesign of the drip tray support. I think I will eliminate the metal support brackets entirely and make a removable "stand" out of polycarbonate (I have some Plexiglas pieces in the garage). Probably screwed to the base to eliminate vibration rattles and to make it easy to remove. To that end, and decided as I wrote this, I went after the other bracket with extreme prejudice and popped it off its spot welds:


The red arrow indicates the area along the side of the frame (gray) that received no powder coating at all. Being that the brackets are attached before the machine is power coated, the entire area under the bracket is exposed. You can also see the same under the bracket where it had not begun to rust.. yet.

The design problem starts with the way the feet are attached. Since they used the captured nuts attached to the base, the tray had to be raised to slide above these. So they came up with that simple, and in regards to corrosion, deadly support system which just as easily could have been two solid bars of metal or non-corroding plastic on either side, sealed to the base after powder coating.

I love the coffee that this machine makes, and the components (boiler, brewhead, pressurestat, OPV, etc.) are all excellent as is the internal layout. But I can't help thinking that after they designed all that, someone at the factory said, "Hey, Angelo! We forgot to make a case to hold it all. I need something designed and ready for production before lunch!" The rattling warming tray, the vibrating drip tray, rattling gauges, etc., and now this.

In regards to rust, I have had some really good results with the "Professional" Rustoleum aerosol paint and using rust converting products as well. It really can be stopped if you deal with it properly.

Would this be any different on the stainless machine? The frame on the espresso machines I've seen are always the same -- a set of L shaped bars. I just thought they would be somewhat corrosion proof

another_jim wrote:Would this be any different on the stainless machine?

I would have to guess, but my guess would be that the stainless machines have an all-stainless framework. Someone here must have one.. Anyone with some info on this? My face panel and drip tray are non-magnetic (not all stainless is), so I would think that the stainless machines could be easily checked with a magnet.

Unfortunate. I have a black one as well and it gets run a lot. It is in my office, gets a couple pounds a week run through it. No rust spots on it. You said you had a towel under the drip tray? That may be the cause of the accelerated rust. If the towel gets wet, it is going to hold water for a very long time keeping everything moist. Water+carbon steel=rust. While stainless may be a good idea, the problem may have been exacerbated if you kept a towel under the drip tray.

cannonfodder wrote: You said you had a towel under the drip tray? Water+carbon steel=rust. While stainless may be a good idea, the problem may have been exacerbated if you kept a towel under the drip tray.

No. I was using the towel to wipe up the area under the tray during a routine cleaning and the bracket popped off (or just moved). I never kept a towel under there, and whenever I removed the drip tray I checked for water under it and dried it up if I found any. When I empty the drip tray I always dry the outside of it before replacing it. The moisture that caused that rust was from normal operation.

cannonfodder wrote: I have a black one as well and it gets run a lot. ..... No rust spots on it.

No visible rust, anyway. I did not notice any of that rust until the bracket fell off because the spot welds rusted away. The right bracket had one good spot weld left (the front one) and the remainder of the bracket was held by the powder coating. If they were all powder coated the same way, I think it is not a matter of if it will rust, but how bad things get under there once you notice it has rusted- probably when the bracket falls off.

Here is the solution I have, at least temporarily:



I have not even glued it together yet (I am out of super glue for plastic at the moment), but two thicknesses of the plastic is exactly the same height as the original brackets, and this "grid" support is removable... and rust proof!

Thanks for the report and temporary solution Randy.

Another tip, just in case it isn't obvious: If you have an espresso machine with a pull-out drip tray, level it such that any water that makes it underneath eventually drips off the front ledge instead of rolling back under the faceplate where it may meet with electrical components (some espresso manufacturers use electrical blocks mounted to the bottom of the machine).

It would be interesting to hear what the manufacturer's comment on this is.

In my understanding in Europe (within the EU) the manufacturer would be liable for rectifying something like this even if the warranty has run out. It might not be an easy process and you would (again in my understanding) need to demonstrate that one could reasonably expect the life of such an espresso machine to be more than three years and that the damage was caused by a design flaw. One would also need to show that the damage was not due to user error. I think the case would be even easier if the damage actually rendered the machine incapable of performing its intended tasks.

Perhaps someone with a better understanding of consumer protection in the EU can chime in and confirm if I am right. Anyway, if there are European users who have similar issues, this might be a route worth exploring.

Br,
Teme

another_jim wrote:Would this be any different on the stainless machine?

Yes. 3.5 years and not a spot of rust under the supports.