Hi everyone,

it's been a while since the Slayer introduction and I think there's a few machines out there doing their thing. Anyone knows how the manual operation is working out in busy cafes? is it ok, good, bad?

I think the main item on the cons list for the Slayer was the necessity to manually 'profile' each shot and thus creating a window of error (each shot might be different). Well that and the attention needed during the shot. Would be interesting to hear something from a user perspective.

Regards,
dsc.



...split from New Slayer espresso machine by moderator...

I second that question. For example with automatics, it is enough to hit the button and you can froth the milk or arrange the plate. While with paddle you have to focus your attention on the coffee. So it would mean:
a) more personnel on the spot
or
b) more time for the preparation of a drink

What does it mean for a busy cafe?

I've asked a barista at RBC in NYC about this, and she said that customers are getting used to the fact that their drink won't be out in 10 seconds: espresso shots are taking up to 50 seconds, with milk drinks adding a bit of time on top of that. The machine has been working out well for them, however, based on her description. It sounds like they are still emulating the vintage lever profile, though: low pressure preinfusion until the first drops, slower ramp up to full pressure, and backing off pressure at the end of the shot.

Especially problematic when a dual spring San Marco or Cimbali piston lever machine will give you a static low pressure pre-infusion and a two stage regressive pressure extraction curve in half the time. And without channeling because it extracts a perfect water column. And that you don't have to stand there and baby sit the thing.

And that you could buy three of them for the price of one Slayer.

Slayer looks cool, though.

Channeling as a result of an uneven coffee bed density wouldn't be fixed by a more even water dispersion right?

If you dose 10 grams in a double portafilter and tap it all to one side, sure. Maybe.

If you believe that tamping has a real impact on extraction than it won't fix it.

Everything that manufacturers do with dispersion plates, jets, distribution chambers and method of screen construction are all designed to achieve what the water column does by its very nature.

Aero press, water column. Clover, vacuum water column. French press, inverted water column.

In a piston machine, the air cavity is on top of the column, with all of the water pressed evenly against the coffee. Traditional machines push water and air in tandem through the coffee filter bed, with all of the tricks designed to mitigate the effect.

Bluecold wrote:Channeling as a result of an uneven coffee bed density wouldn't be fixed by a more even water dispersion right?

Preinfusion stage gets rid of the channeling to some degree.

I got to pull a shot on the Slayer (paired with a Robur) and all I can is that its heaven. Everything feels great the paddles are nice to use and even locking in the basket feel great. Comparing it to la marzocco Lineas, where there is certain pressure needed to lock in the portafilters to the group head. The Slayer can be used delicately and doesn't needs any brute force.

Also the steamer is relatively easy to control, I was told it steams at 2psi instead of 4psi, so home baristas would have no trouble getting use to it. The handle also being such better than those damn knobs.

The taste of the espresso is amazing and has a very thick body which I cannot replicate at home. The best feature, I'm impressed with is that you can play with the pressure whilst pulling the shot, thus make small adjustments whilst the extraction is happening. Pretty neat.

One of the great pleasures of visiting Michael and Angelo's parts warehouse in Los Angeles is describing the latest advances in espresso machine and grinder technology to them and (inevitably) hearing them explain how the problems were solved by the Italians 40 years ago.

And 50% of the time they're not just talking s**t.

Michael used to design espresso machines for Brasilia, and both Michael and Angelo have decades of experience as technicians.

The next time you encounter a machine problem, call them up. If they can't diagnose it on the phone in 45 seconds, I'll be amazed. They are that good.

I have yet to encounter anyone in the machine side of the industry who does not hold them in the highest regard.

ken