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Reviving Futurmat Ariete?

Postby djmonkeyhater on Tue Nov 27, 2007 3:24 am

why wouldn't i drive with the family 50 miles out of the way to a dark garage to buy this on craigslist? even was accused of not being forthright by the wife when i told her that it was so clean that i might keep it instead of getting it for my brother.

her - "Well?"
me - "Oh my god, it has a built in pump. I'm keeping it. It's too big for my brother's kitchen! I mean can you believe it...IT HAS A 110V PROCON PUMP THAT SPINS FREELY! DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT THAT'S WORTH? Twice what I'm paying for it!"
her - "will that stuff fix the other one you spent all of that money on?"
me - "No. That one's 220v."
her - stares straight ahead.

oh yeah, the astoria isn't all done yet either. But i figured a more obscure model from a brand in Spain that doesn't have a US office or widely available parts with a complicated metered dosing logic board would be a good addition to the basment.

Image

Pretty clean for a garage find. Cadmium plated frame, Sirai pressurestat, built-in ProCon that feels good. Chrome grouphead is nice and shows no mileage, some dents in outer panels. Funny steam wand auto-cappuccino deal that seems intact. I almost chucked it but maybe I'll play with it. Broken steam knob, missing portafilter and shower screen are the sum of the missing pieces.

Image

110v sticker on an 8 liter boiler. Tons of solenoids for the auto-frother. Some burnt wires but all in all - pretty good shape. There is another thermostat backing up the Sirai. I haven't figured that one out yet.

Image

So it looks like it might work but this is the power cord BUT What on earth should one do with 4 wires for a 110v machine?
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Postby MachoSilvia on Tue Nov 27, 2007 5:40 am

Could it be three phase wiring? (3 phase plus a fourth wire for earthing) Im no electrician so im not entirely sure at all...

but I have the same machine the two group version, and just thought id say its great, (I dont like to say its an obscure spanish model to my friends, I say 'its the prestigious ITALIAN e61 design of 1961" :wink: )

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Postby HB on Tue Nov 27, 2007 8:35 am

djmonkeyhater wrote:What on earth should one do with 4 wires for a 110v machine?

I'm not an electrician either, but does this help: US and Europe wiring standards what color is which wire?

MachoSilvia wrote:Could it be three phase wiring?

Wikipedia to the rescue: color codes of three phase electric power.
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Postby cannonfodder on Tue Nov 27, 2007 10:30 am

Futurmat use to be Faema of Spain. I ground up rebuilt one a couple of years ago but my unit was 220v and having an onboard pump is nice. My machine had a hard life, but was quite a bit older than that one and a two group. It was still branded Faema.
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Postby djmonkeyhater on Tue Nov 27, 2007 11:35 am

3-phase 110v power makes this machine oh-so-that-much more exclusive! Hopefully the next one will be positive earth.

I'm gonna need to ponder the magnitude of this and of what it will take to connect it to my Seattle house. It's still early in the week for my electrical engineering lesson.

Image

Here's the big brain on Ariete. If I have read correctly at 7AM late for work, wouldn't this 3-phase dream mostly be for amperage for the heating element? I jumpered the motor and it fires right up with 1-phase 110.

Image

I did run standard 110 to it in various ways and got the keypad to light up, the motor to spin and some solenoids to click. But I couldn't get the element to power up.

WAIT - could there be two legs of 110v power to the element? Can that work? There's another thermocouple that goes to another relay device. that does something magicial possibly. It's to the left of the Sirai box in this image.
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Postby cannonfodder on Tue Nov 27, 2007 11:58 am

That is probably the thermal high limit switch. If the pstat sticks closed and the machine super heats the emergency valve will pop to vent pressure but the heater will continue run. That detects the over temperature and shuts down the heater. Like a fancy thermal fuse, remember this is a one group commercial so it is designed to run 24/7. If you are closed for business and the Pstat sticks at 2 am, that prevents your heating element from exploding.

Do you have a 3 way power switch? Most commercial machines have a three way, off, power but no heat, power and heat. It takes a few moments to fill the boiler so you don't want heat to the element until the boiler is filled. I guess it could be three phase 110 but that would be quite unusual. How about a close-up of the spec sticker on the right side of the machine, that should reveal all the mystery.
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Postby jesawdy on Tue Nov 27, 2007 12:10 pm

Methinks it is actually 220V. Like a dryer, the motor and some electrics are 110V but the heating element is 220V. 'Course I am just guessing.

As Dave said, it should have a spec plate somewhere (of 'course I've seen one wrong already in my limited experience). Besides, three phase should have 5 wires, 3 legs, neutral and a ground.

I also agree with Dave on the the other thermostat, that's your safety hi-limit stat to prevent you from a total meltdown.
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Postby cannonfodder on Tue Nov 27, 2007 12:24 pm

I was thinking that myself, not enough lines for a three phase, looks like a 220v or two 110's that share a neutral or two phase but that would be really bizarre. You can see the spec sticker on the right side in the lower photo on the drip tray frame. My machine had two stickers, on the outside right of the frame and another inside left of the drip tray.

That high limit probe should run into the heating element end cap, it is strapped to the heating element on the inside.
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Postby stefano65 on Tue Nov 27, 2007 4:00 pm

I would look at the motor
the solenoid valve
the input of the transformer on the motherboard
and finally the heating element to determinate the voltage

IF is a 220 volt machine
the normal way of wiring
is Blue one leg
Brown and Black together the other leg
yellow/green ground/neutral
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Postby Psyd on Tue Nov 27, 2007 8:10 pm

stefano65 wrote:IF is a 220 volt machine
the normal way of wiring
is Blue one leg
Brown and Black together the other leg
yellow/green ground/neutral


I'm hoping that this is a phrasing issue, 'cause either it's older Euro wiring and blue is hot, as is brown, and black is neutral, or its newer Euro wiring (doncha just love it!?!) where black and brown are hot, and blue is neutral. Maybe I'm misinterpreting your use of 'leg'? In any case, on a (newer) Euro 220V connection, neither of these would be connected together. Both would have a line connection, and the neutral would be the blue, and the yellow w/green would be earth.
I dunno if it helps, but on the new (old) LP Compact I just got step-fathered to has the black one cut off. I'm somewhat skeptical on how this thing is supposed to be wired, as it came with a 20A Edison end -
Cheesy AASCII art u
- I
with brown wired hot, brown wired neutral, and ground as yellow w/ green.
I haven't plugged anything in yet... ; >
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