First off I have to echo Dan's shout out to Counter Culture Coffee for supplying the coffee and the photog (thanks Nathan!).

Finca Mauritania is one of my favorite SOs and I welcomed the chance to test it on a few different platforms. It's always a bit of a challenge to balance the complex fruitiness/acidity of this coffee with some sweetness - somewhat like finding the middle ground between orange slices and orange peel.

There were several takeaways for me in this little shoot out. First off good coffees produce good espresso. All three of us ultimately produced espresso that any shop would have been proud to serve. Secondly temperature matters. I really got into a groove when I notched the temperature of the LM down from 200F to 198F. That made a huge difference is getting rid of the funky finish and much improved the overall balance of sweet and sour. Thirdly high end machines and grinders, at least on this day tend to be more consistent. Although Dan and Mike produced some nice shots I was able (definitely the macchina not me) to pull consistently good shots with minor tweaks on the grinder once the temperature was set.

The Breville did well under Mike's experienced hand. Once dialed in it produced sweet coffees (albeit maybe a bit blander than the Strada) with some nice creamy mouth feel.

I've had some great coffee from Dan's Semiautomatica in the past. It was the least consistent of the day. I'm left wondering whether there were pressure issues with it on Friday. Anyways as Alton Brown once said - even great cooks have bad days!

It's really interesting to hear your views on this machine, and being someone that will be in the hunt for a machine in the price range probably sometime early next year, I would be interested in how it stacks up against machine in it's price range.

To me it sounds like a Quickmill Silvano could give this machine a run for its money and is 250 dollars less.

Thanks again for having us over Dan and of course the lovely coffee provided by Counter Culture. I'll be discussing the Breville here since I was stationed on that unit.

The BES800XL is an attractive unit with its brushed aluminum exterior that mixes in well with most kitchens (and easier to keep clean). The layout is semi-symmetrical with nice, backlight buttons and display and it sits low enough so that cabinet height shouldn't be a factor. Expecting something more plasticy and cheaper feeling from the buttons, knobs and levers, I was surprised by how smooth everything felt. I especially liked the easy water refill opening at the top front of the machine and the water level sight. Running out of water was something I used to constantly check on my Millenium.

Breville sent a bottomless portafilter along with the demo unit and pulling shots seemed just like other prosumer machines. The vibe pump was a bit on the noisy side but that's to be expected. Breville gives you plenty of room to "fit" the portafilter in the grouphead so locking in is easy as 1-2-3. I don't think I missed once.

Steaming is going to be weaker than other dual boilers out there but with some practice, the small 3 hole tip can produce good microfoam. I tried out a few different volumes of milk and steam pitchers and my recommendation is to use smaller (12 oz) pitchers to produce the best results (more vortexing).

Espresso results are for the most part impressive. Espresso inconsistency that morning had to do mostly with getting the right grind setting, age of the coffee and possibly the temperature. It was set at 200f the entire time. Lots of crema in the shots but maybe lacking in some complexity and flavors that the Strada could pull. One shot I pulled was oddly smokey and chocolate filled, almost like La Forza or other darker roasted espresso.

I think everyone at the get together agreed this is an impressive step for Breville but of course we all have questions about long-term reliability due to the parts used to put this unit together considering the price. Will this be similar to what the Vario has brought to the community? A word of advice: those of you who are budget conscious looking at this unit, don't go cheap on the grinder. You'll only make it more difficult to pull consistently good shots and waste coffee in the meantime.

Mike

ampguy wrote:Hi Phil,

Thanks for the clarification. Would it be possible for you to further elaborate on the group head pid / element?

Is it a closed loop? How does one adjust the group head separate from the main boiler temp.

Is the main display temp the boiler temp, or the temp at the group head, just above the shower screen.

Which units have 100W heating elements, and which units have 200W heating units, and are these just turned on or off? based on a true pid for the grouphead, or based on the main boiler pid with estimated or adjusted offset factors?

Thanks!

On the Brew side of the machine, there are 2 separate NTCs, 1 for the Group element & the other for the brew boiler element. Both these sense temp and provide feedback to the 2 independant PIDs controlled through software to provide water delivered to a Scace device that is the same as the temp indicated on the LCD. Yes, there must be some temp offset to get the Scace temp to match the LCD temp, but that's a software deal. You can't control the Group temp separately from the brew boiler temp, they work together to provide water at the target temp to a Scace.

The US version, BES900XL has a 100W Group element & the AUS version, BES900 has a 200W Group element.

Cheers, Phil

Was at the mall and discovered this unit now available at 15% off from Williams Sonoma. Retail price is $1,199. Only bad news is the sale ends on the 20th, which is today. Anyone looking to buy one may want to take advantage of the offer.

Looks like a good deal is on the table for one of these right now - my daily holiday barrage of email offers from Williams Sonoma contained this coupon code gem:

SAVENOW

The code is valid through December 11th and discounts an item priced $1000 and over by 30%. The Breville Dual Boiler Espresso Machine is priced at $1195 so the savings are close to $360. Even in a state with high sales taxes like mine the price shipped to my door would be just shy of $900. Below is an image of a test cart I ran earlier this morning.

Thanks Phil, I appreciate your responses. Also, thanks Eric, this is a very tempting deal!

Can anyone tell me how fast this unit steams milk, say 8 or 12 oz from 40 to 140F?

Thanks!

Having used the machine a fair bit I can tell you it steams a little on the slow side. I can't give you exact number. However I can tell you that the microfoam it creates is a thing of beauty. I've never made foam so velvety and smooth.

I agree about the milk steaming. Slower than my Vetrano, but it produced nice microfoam, and even some latte art in my incompetent hands!

Thanks Nixter and Sweaner, so do you folks have recent ones post the steaming issue fix? Would you say it would steam 8 oz of milk from 40-140 in 15, 30, 45, or 60 seconds?