Hi guys,

can't get extremely good micro foam on the R58. Decent but not as good as I want to be.
Decent latte art but not extremely detailed.

Settings are all maxed out, purging is done before steaming. Boiler feels a bit slow to come up.

So I wanted to ask - any one did the steam wand modification here?
Removing of the insulation inside to improve steaming performance?

The Rocket R58 can't use the set of 4 Rocket tips, already tried that and they didn't fit.
Only have 2 steam tips that are provided with the machine.

Thank you!

I just returned an R58 V2 for the very same reason. I ran the steam boiler at max pressure 1.4bar and tried both steam tips provided. Steam was CRAP. I also have a Giotto PP V2 and that thing is a steam monster at 1bar compared to the R58.

It's strange how a machine made by the same company can have such different steaming capabilities?
Maybe it has to do with the double boiler design.

Oh well, I can't return mine so I have to live with it.
Have to find some way to make it work...

Any help will be much appreciated!

Thanks guys, looking forward to your inputs.

It may help people if you explain more, e.g. no power to begin with, starts with good power but running out of gas at the end, wet steam, etc. Couple thoughts, can you raise the temp on the steam boiler? Is there a water level device that you can adjust? Maybe sensor is too high. Have you tried waiting longer for machine to heat up? On mine, even though boiler is up to temp, if I pull the trigger right away the steaming is not nearly as good as if I wait good time for whole machine to heat up. I dunno why exactly, but thinking maybe even though technically up to temp the water still needs time to convert to steam??? That's all I got.

mkv wrote: Removing of the insulation inside to improve steaming performance?

I have a different machine (Andreja Premium - HX), but can tell you that I removed the teflon tube in the steam wand and saw quite an increase in steam power.

Yes, killing the no-burn wands "no burn ability", is a quick and easy way to better the steam performance.

Otherwise, the best thing to do, is make sure when you start steaming, the brew boiler heating element has just switched off, so hopefully it will stay off throughout the entire steam process. Then, purge the steam, and start steaming just as the steam boiler element is about to turn off, with the hope of it staying on throughout the whole process.

If the brew boiler calls for heat during the steaming process, your steam will dive. The brew boiler has priority. I run my Duetto in 15amp, which gives the brew boiler priority, and so I time the steaming so the brew boiler wont call for heat whilst steaming.

HoldTheOnions wrote:It may help people if you explain more, e.g. no power to begin with, starts with good power but running out of gas at the end, wet steam, etc. Couple thoughts, can you raise the temp on the steam boiler? Is there a water level device that you can adjust? Maybe sensor is too high. Have you tried waiting longer for machine to heat up? On mine, even though boiler is up to temp, if I pull the trigger right away the steaming is not nearly as good as if I wait good time for whole machine to heat up. I dunno why exactly, but thinking maybe even though technically up to temp the water still needs time to convert to steam??? That's all I got.

Great thanks!

Problem is - Power is OK or average, but runs out of power nearing the end.
Steam is medium dry, not super dry.

I think maybe I need to remove the insulation - since it gets hot anyway and it doesn't do anything to my operations.

JmanEspresso wrote:Yes, killing the no-burn wands "no burn ability", is a quick and easy way to better the steam performance.

Otherwise, the best thing to do, is make sure when you start steaming, the brew boiler heating element has just switched off, so hopefully it will stay off throughout the entire steam process. Then, purge the steam, and start steaming just as the steam boiler element is about to turn off, with the hope of it staying on throughout the whole process.

If the brew boiler calls for heat during the steaming process, your steam will dive. The brew boiler has priority. I run my Duetto in 15amp, which gives the brew boiler priority, and so I time the steaming so the brew boiler wont call for heat whilst steaming.

Interesting info.
Never thought of it this way - I guess the brew boiler element always has priority over the steam boiler element in most machines.

Question - why start steaming just as the steam boiler is about to turn off?
Would it be better to start when the steam boiler has just turned on and will remain On during the steaming?

Looking forward to some clarification.


Thanks guys!

mkv wrote:Question - why start steaming just as the steam boiler is about to turn off?
Would it be better to start when the steam boiler has just turned on and will remain On during the steaming?

The element shuts off at the top of the temp / pressure curve - and the temp will go up a tiny bit more from residual heat in the element. If you wait for it to cycle back on, the temp & pressure are at the low point in the cycle, and opening the steam valve reduces the pressure and temp (pv = nrt) a bit more.

mkv wrote:Interesting info.
Never thought of it this way - I guess the brew boiler element always has priority over the steam boiler element in most machines.

Question - why start steaming just as the steam boiler is about to turn off?
Would it be better to start when the steam boiler has just turned on and will remain On during the steaming?

Looking forward to some clarification.


Thanks guys!

Not ALL machines that are dual boilers, give brew boiler priority. The machines which are 20amp, allow both heaters to be on at the same time, independent of what the other is doing. My duetto would run like that in 20amp. The machines which are 15amp, or run in 15amp mode, heat both boilers one at a time, with the priority to the brew boiler. The idea being, maintaining consistent shot inter and intra shot, is more important.

The reason you start steaming just as the steam boiler is about to turn off, is so you are steaming at the highest pressure the steam boiler can provide, and since the heater is ON already when you start, the initial dip in pressure, wont be as great. Also, the heater will stay on, and will keep the pressure as high as it can.

If my steam boiler heater has just turned off, and the pressure is at its highest.. and then I do a quick purge of the steam wand, two things happen. The pressure drops almost immediately to 1bar, and the heating element kicks on right away. If I then grabbed my milk and started steaming, the pressure would hover around, and drop slightly below, 1bar, even though the heater is on. IF I wait until the pressure goes all the way up to almost 1.5bar, but not quite there, and THEN start steaming, there is enough momentum of heat in the boiler with the element on, to have only a small dip in pressure, and maintain the highest pressure possible, throughout the whole steaming process.

I dont give my duetto any breaks when it comes to steam. I run the boiler as high as possible, and I use a fast steam tip. Its awesome for my most common steaming, which is a 12oz pitcher.. but if I need to do bigger pitchers for multiple drinks, I need to switch to slower tip, because otherwise, the steam pressure drops too low. But for a 12oz pitcher, it takes maybe 8-10 seconds, and its just a quick ch-ch for the stretch and then just swirl the milk and keep it from flinging out of the pitcher. Powerful, Dry steam, is the key to excellent milk.

You want the boiler to maintain the highest pressure it can throughout steaming. By waiting until just before the heating element turns off to start your steaming, you'll get the highest pressure the machine i capable of. You might need to play with exactly when to start steaming so that the light stays on.. if you push it too late, the light may turn off just as you're turning the knob, and then you'll get a drop and play catchup. You want that light on the whole time if you can.