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Plumbing La Cimbali Jr. and other questions

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Link to "Plumbing La Cimbali Jr. and other questions"by Junior on Thu Jun 18, 2009 1:37 pm

Greetings, as a long-time lurker, review reader and FAQ peruser, I've made the leap from the sidelines. My purchases over the last month are an odd variation on the "what should I get for under $1,000?" question asked ad nauseum. But as a habitual tinkerer, I've picked up a used Major and a used La Cimbali Jr. DT/1. Date of manufacture on the jr. is uncertain, but seems to be about the same as others from circa 2000. If I'm lucky, the expected reconditioning will keep me in my budget. So far so good, I picked up the Jr. yesterday (from a State of Oregon Gov. surplus auction) and while it is missing the portafilter and baskets, it also did not come with a family of mice living inside. I'll post pictures of the reconditioning as it progresses. Biggest problems so far is one missing case screw and a sizable ding on the group doughnut which may need a rechrome sooner rather than later. Of course, the real tests will come after water hookup which leads me to my questions.

The first question I have is the water line connection. It looks as if the adapter used is a BSPT to US Standard for the hose hookup. Unfortunately, this causes the line to kink slightly between the machine and the counter top, even with the legs fully extended. I'd rather not go to long legs and, in fact, if I could get the legs to their smallest adjustment, the machine can go under my home cabinet before it likely is moved to my office. Has anyone found a suitable elbow adapter or other solution to this issue?

Second, I noted a little scale in the plastic "dosing" reservoir (sorry, still learning the terminology here), is there a good way of removing that for cleaning or will a vacuum and citric acid soak be the way to go? I expect a full descale of the boiler will be in order once I take off the heating element and peak inside. Fortunately, the water in are area is generally soft. I didn't notice any bad signs of scale or leaks outside the boiler.

Any other tips of what I should be looking for as I bring an unknown machine up to speed? I'll likely try to do a large parts order to get the basics (portafilter, baskets, tamper, cleaning supplies, new burrs, perhaps new group gasket and screen) at the outset. Anything else which will be a must have?

Thanks for reading the longish initial post.
Michael
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Posts: 24
Joined: Jun 18, 2009
Location: Portland, Or

Link to "Plumbing La Cimbali Jr. and other questions"by Junior on Mon Jun 22, 2009 3:20 pm

Okay, no one answered those questions, so I am back with more. Maybe it's like fishing and I need to change up the lures now and then...

I've given up for the moment finding an elbow adapter which works for the input line, I'll just have to live with the higher legs and out from under the cabinets for now. Several parts were stamped with a 1995 manufacturing date, so I'm going to revise my guess and say this is a circa 1996 machine.

I cleaned up the grouphead, rubber gasket looked fine and still pliable. The old stickers and gummy residue cleared from the case. Opened up the sirai pstat and the membrane was flexible. The heating elements came out and not too much scale. The gasket on the heat element, on the other hand, was fused and bad looking. Paper or plastic (teflon)? I guess I'll be testing that next. The worst surprise thus far was an inch thick block of very funky old grounds compressed into the hollow leg on one side. It took an awl to pry out what appeared to be a solid block about an inch thick, filling the entire leg. I'll still do a complete descale, however, it was time to plug it in, turn on the water and cross my fingers.

It came to life (slowly at first). I heard the autofill kick in, the clear reservoir filled up. Not really knowing what to expect, I had to put my hand on the boiler to make sure it was warming up. After a few minutes, the pressure gauge ticked up, the vacuum breaker hissed, the little green ball floated up and we were good to go. Some leaking from the element (I assume that a new gasket will do the trick) and from the pstat as it came up to pressure. An area of deposits on the bottom of the pstat case suggests that is not the first time. I didn't see a gasket on the bottom half of the case, is it simply a matter of tightening the screws or am I missing a way to control a leak?

Next, the pressure gauge is not calibrated. It's at .6 cold (and even when I removed it completely from the valve). At pressure, it went to 1.6 with a little under .2 deadband. So it appears to be about what is expected from a linear error. Is this how the gauge works? Can I recalibrate, or is this a "live with it or buy a new one" type of thing?

Up next, waiting for the portafiller to arrive, adjusting the "fill rods" and trying my first shot. My first shot ever on this side of the machine. When I do the descale, is there a trick to draining this boiler?

Thanks for any answers or just for reading along while you wait to see how I screw this up.
Michael
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Posts: 24
Joined: Jun 18, 2009
Location: Portland, Or

Link to "Plumbing La Cimbali Jr. and other questions"by erics on Mon Jun 22, 2009 5:33 pm

The pic below is the standard hookup for the Quickmill Vetrano. It is very flexible SS braided hose with 3/8" BSP fittings (one ell, one straight) on the ends. The hose is available from Chris' Coffee and probably many other parts houses. On the machine end, it screws onto a 3/8" BSP male nipple.
Image
I would think you could remove the BSP/NPT adaptor on your machine and use this type of hose. You have what type of pump in this DT/1 ??
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erics
 
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Link to "Plumbing La Cimbali Jr. and other questions"by bgn on Mon Jun 22, 2009 5:40 pm

I owned this same machine for a while. The dosing reservoir at the back is easily removable to clean it up. Don't know why it would be hard to find an elbow fitting for the water line, but I didn't have to look for one, as mine had it already. If you're comfortable with taking stuff apart and putting it back together, the Jr. is great. The group, hx pipe and element are all easily removable, which should give you a clear shot at descaling/cleaning the boiler. As to the coffee grounds in the foot, I assume that this is from the drip tray overflowing, which fills the frame of the machine with water and used grounds. Make sure the hole that allows flow from the removable drip tray is drilled out big enough to allow water/grounds flow.
Have fun!
bgn
 
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Joined: Oct 20, 2006
Location: Vancouver, Canada

Link to "Plumbing La Cimbali Jr. and other questions"by Junior on Mon Jun 22, 2009 6:45 pm

Thanks for the replies. This is a vibe pump dt1. I'll post some before and after pictures. When I took the hose in to a hardware store, it threaded a turn or so on a 1/4" male, so I assume that it is a BSP thread. I was surprised that it seems smaller than a 3/8" but maybe that is simply the threading issue. The next parts order I make will have a set of gaskets (group and heat element) along with a bsp hose or adapter which actually fit.

The grounds in the leg is interesting since the rest of the machine was *fairly* clean and the leg at issue is on the opposite side as the drain hole. I did chisel out some gunk from the smaller drain assembly under the drain tray. When I turned it on for the first time and tested the hot water and steam which when I manually dumped down into that assembly, it did clear. However, there is a long hose which comes through the bottom of that assembly (from the 3-way?) which is cemented in rather close to the front edge, taking up about 1/3 of the volume of the drain assemble area. I wondered if that set up would cause water to come out over the sides. Any harm from shortening that hose?
Michael
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Posts: 24
Joined: Jun 18, 2009
Location: Portland, Or


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