We just moved to a new house. Unfortunately (?) the PID Silvia got damaged during the move and need to be upgraded. We are still deciding on what to get.

This month we were gonna put in a new kitchen. I kind of put off plumbing in the espresso machine as I didn't want to drill holes in the granite. The project kind of escalated though, and now all the walls are down too. I can hook up everything and pull the hoses through the wall. That would be much easier to fix if I decide for some reason I don't want the machine there later. Obviously I would not have any fittings or couplings inside the wall, just the hose.

Questions:
- What size hose do I need for the water supply?
- What size hose do I need for the drain?
- Are any of the above dependent on machine?
- Does the drain ever plug up, and is that a problem?
- Any downsides to plumbing in (apart from the chance of leaks...)?

Thx!

Normally for commercial application we do 2inches hole for drain braided hose and cord with a Removable plug
consider space for a water softener under inside the cabinet
a must if you are going plumbed

Stefano, what size lines do you like for the drain line and the water line? We are also doing this. I was going with a 3/8" supply line, but not sure what to use for the drain.

Have room in the cabinet for a good small shop type vacuum cleaner with a hose that is easily reached and a separate wall switch to its outlet . You will really enjoy cleanup around grinder and knock box. Floor too!!
Many drain hoses I have seen are from ~half inch ID minimum to three quarter inch for high volume applications so they will flow well and flush easily. Don't have any low loops to collect water between the machine and the "P"trap of the waste pipe.
Happy Installation!
-Richard

I just plumbed in an espresso machine and a fridge. Both use 1/4 inch hose.

I have a ½ inch line with filters and regulators in the basement. That runs into a T that feeds two 3/8 lines that run up into the espresso bar. Each line has its own regulator. I ran two lines, one for my main machine, and the other for the occasional visiting machine. I also ran a 30 amp 220 and two 20 amp 110's. Glad I did, I have needed them all at one time or another.

Please google "drain pipe sizing" regarding minimum drain pipe. For example, a wash basin is 1 discharge unit, kitchen sink is considered 2 discharge units, a washing machine is 3 discharge units, etc. The drain has to be properly sized; namely, a larger drain does not necessarily mean less clogging, but more, due to accumulation of debris in a larger drain pipe. Add all the discharge units to arrive at correct drain pipe sizing. It may vary from city to city.

Since you are remodeling the whole kitchen, I assume city inspectors will have to sign off the design. They are very friendly to home owners. Most cities also require a permit for 220V appliances, so you might as well add it to the permit application; you will be able to install any espresso machine you want. It is usually easier to apply for everything you may need initially and ask the city officials, than to worry about it later.

You may also want to review these National Kitchen and Bath Association planning guidelines http://www.nkba.org/guidelines/kitchen.aspx regarding landing space and prep area in a kitchen. Many times I see suboptimal space planning for an activity that requires many gadgets and hot surfaces, like espresso making.

Sorry, did not realize you are in Norway. The requirements likely will be different.

Dieter01 wrote:We just moved to a new house. Unfortunately (?) the PID Silvia got damaged during the move and need to be upgraded. We are still deciding on what to get.

This month we were gonna put in a new kitchen. I kind of put off plumbing in the espresso machine as I didn't want to drill holes in the granite. The project kind of escalated though, and now all the walls are down too. I can hook up everything and pull the hoses through the wall. That would be much easier to fix if I decide for some reason I don't want the machine there later. Obviously I would not have any fittings or couplings inside the wall, just the hose.

Questions:
- What size hose do I need for the water supply?
- What size hose do I need for the drain?
- Are any of the above dependent on machine?
- Does the drain ever plug up, and is that a problem?
- Any downsides to plumbing in (apart from the chance of leaks...)?

Thx!

Hello, Thomas
I did this in my own home about 2 years ago. This is what I did, anyway, and it has worked very well. All the connections, and also the power supplies are installed in the cabinet under the machine and the cables and pipes go through the worktop (I'm not wealthy enough to buy granite worktops, and anyway, they reflect too much with the under-cabinet lighting )

You may not be in the EU but I'm fairly sure you'll have european standard metric plumbing, which makes everything nice and simple.

Water supply - standard 15mm copper pipe. I installed an in-line pressure limiter, and teminated it in a standard washing machine type tap (with an integrated backcheck valve).

Water drain - standard pvc 32mm drain pipe. The end is fitted vertically into the cabinet under the machine, and the pipe from the machine is a loose fit into it, allowing an air gap. The 32mm pipework then goes behind the cabinets, into the same drain used by the dishwasher (another air gap at this point), which then goes into the house drainage system through a "U" type bend.

If you can share a water trap like this, it means it will get well flushed though each time anything (in my case the dishwasher) runs water through it. If coffee grounds were to accumulate, this is a possibe risk area.

Machine-specifics:- My machine came with a Brita cannister filter. The connection into this is a standard washing machine type female screw fitting, so the washing machine tap was exactly what I needed. The outlet drain pipe is a wire-reinforced plastic pipe, can't remember the diameter, but it is a loose fit inside a 32mm waste pipe.

No, the drain has never clogged, but I do pour a jug of water into the drip tray from time to time, and of course any flushing/backflushing goes the same way, so a chemical backflush also goes through the system. The way my machine works is that the outlet from the 3-way valve goes directly into the waste plumbing inside the machine, not into the driptray. This gives it a bit of a "blast" every time it is used.

You do need to be careful that any joints in the plastic waste are nice and smooth to avoid any grounds build up. Because the normal flow rate will be fairly low, if possible, increase the pipe "fall" a bit from what would be generally recommended. Also it may not be easy to get enough fall directly from the machine into whatever drain system you install, unless the pipe from the machine goes down through the worktop, so in your case, that bit will need some careful thought I reckon.

There are NO downsides at all. You will wonder how all the poor people who have to fill tanks, empty drip trays etc, actually manage

Hope this helps.

Thought I'd chime with a question others may find useful. Out water is already very soft. My rough testing confirms the local water districts report

Alkalinity average 20.4 ppm range 13.4 ppm to 28.4 ppm
Calcium hardness average 8.9 ppm range 7.1 ppm to 12.0 ppm
Total Hardness average 11.3 ppm range 9.2 ppm to 13.8 ppm

This water is softer than 'softened' water in the majority of the country. It seems to me a water softener is not only not necessary, but runs the risk of lowering mineral content below what is required for water level sensors.