Need replacement RTD for Francis Francis! X5

Equipment doesn't work? Troubleshooting? If you're handy, members can help.
maberlin
Posts: 2
Joined: 14 years ago

#1: Post by maberlin »

I need to replace the RTD on my X5. Is this a standard component that one can order from an electronics vendor or do I have to deal with the elusive parts department of Francis Francis!?%#&


Any help would be much appreciated!

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Bluecold
Posts: 1774
Joined: 16 years ago

#2: Post by Bluecold »

You know for sure it's the sensor you need to replace?
They tend to not die.

If you are sure it's the rtd, measure resistance at 0 degrees Celsius. It's a rough indicator to see what type it is. If it reads 100ohm at 0 degrees, it probably is a Pt100. They are not expensive and readily available.
LMWDP #232
"Though I Fly Through the Valley of Death I Shall Fear No Evil For I am at 80,000 Feet and Climbing."

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Zircote
Posts: 53
Joined: 15 years ago

#3: Post by Zircote »

Check the sensor first
It is unlikely
More probably the temp control board
Mine blew sometime ago, the sensor was still good
Francis has not been selling parts for some time and no other machine is using this setup
I ended up replacing the controls with a PID and new sensor for less than the postage to ship the machine back and forth to the official repair site

maberlin (original poster)
Posts: 2
Joined: 14 years ago

#4: Post by maberlin (original poster) »

Thanks Bluecold and Zircote for your advice. The reason I think it is the sensor is because it is corroded on one side and I suspect there may be an internal short, but I will test it first. If it is the board I will go with the PID solution. Can you direct me to your source for the PID you installed?

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Bluecold
Posts: 1774
Joined: 16 years ago

#5: Post by Bluecold »

I used these items.
http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_ ... ucts_id=14
http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_ ... ducts_id=9
http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_ ... ucts_id=46
and a hacked heatsink on the SSR.

I think a smaller thermocouple would be better suited for your use since you've already got a thermowell.
Something like this:
http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_ ... cts_id=144

Don't know how you'd switch to steaming temperature though. You could in theory glue a 145C button thermostat to the boiler and a PID override switch to use the button thermostat for steaming.
LMWDP #232
"Though I Fly Through the Valley of Death I Shall Fear No Evil For I am at 80,000 Feet and Climbing."

Zircote
Posts: 53
Joined: 15 years ago

#6: Post by Zircote »

I used the Aubers 1/32 DIN PID and their Miniature RTD
I have it set up to use the same button controls for brewing and steaming
The original ready lights do not function any longer
The temps are shown on the PID
I can not find the schematic at the moment but will look harder if you need it

fattmoo
Posts: 1
Joined: 14 years ago

#7: Post by fattmoo »

I have a X1 and plan on doing this same mod. I picked up a used x1 at a garage sale and they swore it worked... I guess that was a half truth because the pump works and the boiler only gets hot when the steam switch is on but not when in brew mode. Upon inspecting the board it had two resistors that were burnt out and one foot of a transistor burnt. Considering Francis wiring diagrams don't exist I had to guess at the ohms of the resistors. I soldered new ones in and resoldered the foot and put it all back together... no change, I think the whole board is shot.

So will doing this mod with the PID and an SSR take the place of the circuit board? Also once you get it together I assume you set the temp at 100C pull your shot, then push the + on the PID until it gets up to steam temp.?. Also are you not using either of the p-stats and just by passing them? If you could find your schematic I'd appreciate it. Last question, where did you mount the PID?

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Zircote
Posts: 53
Joined: 15 years ago

#8: Post by Zircote »

I have gotten some other requests for this info and will try and put something together this weekend
In the mean time read this description of a Silvia Mod
http://www.skenedesign.com/Silvia
For my project I used:
Aubers 1/32 PID
Aubers Miniture RTD
Aubers 25 amp SSR
5 volt DC cell phone charger - any DC supply between 3-32 volts will work I just had this one sitting around
2 ln4001 diodes
male and female spade connectors
hook up wire

I mounted all of the components in the machine
The PID is cut into the upper front panel vertically to the left side of the ready lights

exchaoordo
Posts: 2
Joined: 13 years ago

#9: Post by exchaoordo »

I have replaced parts on the X1 and wonder if I don't have the same sort of problem: the Boiler only Heats when the Steam is switched on, not when the machine is switched on. I checked the voltage across the leads to that sensor, and I get .5 volts, but I don't know what that means.

Any ideas on what I should check to figure out why the boiler doesn't heat when the machine is switched on? I wonder if I can replace the whole circuit board?

Zircote
Posts: 53
Joined: 15 years ago

#10: Post by Zircote »

exchaoordo
As was noted in the previous posts
It is unlikely the RTD is faulty, but you can test it as Bluecold suggested
It is most likely the temp control board
The machine uses the RTD for both steam and brewing temp, if one function fails that points to a control failure
You can replace the board if you can buy the part

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