mauijer wrote:I would

+1

Might not be possible if the high heat steam system plays a role in the water mixing tech to bring the water temp to desired brew temp.

I do lattes in the morning and espresso in the early afternoon so the present design is cool with me. It will be a plus if the steam system can be turned off if not needed like some e61 double boilers that I previously considered for my next upgrading.

The steam system is always off unless you use it, as this is a thermoblock system and not a conventional (steam)boiler.

Checkout the video in the Marketplace section. I read somewhere it is an independent steam boiler circuit.

JojoS wrote:Checkout the video in the Marketplace section. I read somewhere it is an independent steam boiler circuit.

Beaniac wrote:The steam system is always off unless you use it, as this is a thermoblock system and not a conventional (steam)boiler.

Check out post #52 in this thread on page 6. John explains how it works. It's a new system altogether for heating water in an espresso machine.

Guys, as a vendor I'm not allowed to participate in this forum and answer your questions, so if you have anything to say that you'd like me to comment on, please do it over here: Decent Espresso Machine - PREORDERING NOW

JojoS wrote:Checkout the video in the Marketplace section. I read somewhere it is an independent steam boiler circuit.

you should re-read all the posts from Decent and more things will make sense, this machine does not have any boilers.

As suggested by vendor, better to address all product related queries to Marketplace to get manufacturer's feedback. Not really sure what the exact term to use for the instant steam source that is heated to 170C, what is clear is it is not thermoblock.

An evening with the Decent Espresso DE1+

I was fortunate enough to have John stop by a couple days ago and give me a rundown of the DE1+ (I happen to live in between where he woke up, and where he was planning on going to sleep - lucky me).

This was all a bit last minute, but I ran out and picked up a bag of Rose Line Catapult Blend which I have enjoyed in the past.

John was all set up by 6:45 or so. We compared tampers ( ) - his Decent Tamper, and my EazyTamp - I still prefer mine, but his was great, and definitely felt a lot smoother - no metal on metal. My HG-1 wasn't dialed in, but that turned out to be a blessing. Routine was: 20g doses, RDT, grind into blind tumbler, WDT, dose, level, tamp.

I wasn't taking notes, so this is all on memory, but here's the gist.

He used a lever profile - preinfusion, up to 9 bar, hold for a few seconds, then a slow decline.

First shot ran a little quick, we could see on the graph that when the machine transitioned from preinfusion to full pressure there was a momentary drop in pressure. Anyway, the shot was excellent, but John diagnosed this to mean that we hadn't fully saturated the large 20g dose. He upped the flow rate of the preinfusion stage on the second shot and the resulting graph was nice and smooth - and the shot was amazing.

On the third shot John had be grind a little finer. I forget what we were trying to accomplish, but I remember that it worked, the third shot was even better. I was really impressed with John's ability to diagnose problems and change variables to get the result he wanted.

The fourth shot we decided to make a cappuccino. I normally use an Espro Toroid pitcher since I'm not that great, but I used John's pitcher and his milk thermometer. I usually just go by feel and stop once I can't keep my hand on the pitcher anymore - turns out I have a low tolerance for heat. I stopped the steam too early (I think around 140F), but we still had a pretty nice texture. The resulting drink was excellent.

Overall I was extremely impressed. In the days since I've been unable to replicate the quality of those shots we pulled on my Pro 300. My steam is also wetter, but about the same amount of power I think. I've been planning on upgrading to an L1 for a little while now, and now I really don't know what to do. The L1 can pull one type of shot perfectly. The DE1+ can at the very least come very close to copying it, but it can also:

• Pull many other types of shots
• Adjust more variables than any machine on the market
• See graphs of exactly what happened to help you diagnose problems
• Oh yeah, and it's very small!

There are some quirks though - and honestly as small as they are - I'm not sure I want them in my life.

• There's a small fan running in the back of the machine to cool the computer, it's plenty quiet, but it's not silent (EDIT: It doesn't run all the time, just when the machine is hot)
• The tablet is powered separately from the machine - but can run on battery power as long as it's charged.
• If you want the machine to turn itself on in the morning the tablet needs to stay on all night - in a low power mode with a splash screen.
• The machine heats up super quick (group too), but you would need to pull some water through the machine before you pull a shot every time after it's been off to warm up some tubes and stuff (sorry can't remember the details)
• Unfair to call this is a downside, but it's a little overwhelming having that many variables to play with at your fingertips. I feel like having the DE1+ would force me to become a much better barista if I wanted to keep drinking good coffee.

So DE1+ or L1 - well I still don't know, they both have advantages over the other. The DE1+ probably has more advantages, and was just so ridiculously impressive, but I can't help but think that a second generation might be what I need.