Be advised that most of the used Ebay SJs in that price range or even higher are well used & will require a serious cleaning, repainting/power cord? & new burrs. You might get lucky but you should be prepared to put some time into it if you want something that looks decent on the counter.

rharlow wrote:How long did it take you to find this kind of deal. Are they available "all the time" on ebay or do I have to watch the sales for a month or so? Just curious.

Those great deals have been pretty hard to come by, lately, unless you're OK with an old, very, very beat up Super Jolly. If you want one that's recent (they have 350W rather than 250W motors, and they have a nicer look to them), it will likely take a good deal of patience.

Here's a pic of the older SJ style (this is my old grinder):


The older Super Jollies tend to have somewhat sharper lines, and are slicghtly smaller. However, they are most easily picked out by the "body tray" that they have: note how far forward the body comes. Also note the dull aluminum doser chamber in the front.

Please think nothing of how clean this one is: I got that for about $120 3 years ago, and it required many, many hours of stripping the powdercoat and then sanding carefully to give it a good finish. The cheapest SJ's on eBay are always dirty as all get out, and also chipped and scratched to the point of being unpresentable. Also, as John said, It needed a new cord and a new set of burrs.

Here's a comparison to new:


This is my SJ that I bought new with "dura-mill" burrs. It grinds a lot faster and quieter than the older one. Note that there is no "body tray" and that the body has, overall, smoother lines. It's also got the newer stainless steel doser that is much shinier.

Getting a newer one will cost you more or take a lot longer to get. The thing to remember about eBay SJ's is that you need to be prepared to work hard to refurbish one, unless you get great pics to show otherwise. But the ones with excellent pics usually go for more.

If no one has suggested it, you could look at a spring lever, namely the PV Lusso. Dan has done some reviewing, so there is plenty of info. Paired with a decent grinder it makes great espresso, is easy to use, very consistent. And you can steam milk and pull shots at the same time, which is very nice for milk drinks.

PC

rharlow wrote:How long did it take you to find this kind of deal. Are they available "all the time" on ebay or do I have to watch the sales for a month or so? Just curious.

The SJs are available most of the time, but they almost all go for more than that. Many are going for $350-$400 these days.

sweaner wrote:The SJs are available most of the time, but they almost all go for more than that. Many are going for $350-$400 these days.

Thats what I have seen so when a 3 month old(light home use) SJ came up on CG recently for $550 I was surprised it didn't sell. I ended up buying it for $500 & since the SJ hopper was damaged in shipping the seller bought me the short Mini hopper I was going to buy anyways. The hopper sweeps clean enough that I didn't bother with the tape mod. I did install the generic milk jug version of the Schectermatic & removed the portafilter holder. Now if I can just avoid reading those Robur vs SJ posts I should be done upgrading for awhile.

One on the local craigslist looks to have been banged up on the bottom leading edge but looks to be in good shape other than that. Not bad for $350. If it hasn't been used in a shop, the burrs are likely still in fine shape.

Mark

Remember when I said I had decided to purchase the La Spaziale Mini Vivaldi II? My plan was to order it right after the holidays in hopes I could get a good deal. Well thanks to @mhoy, I looked at craigslist.com and found that there are a lot of items for sale. Most of the items were either big commercial machines or small "krups-like" machines, neither of which appeals to me. But it got me thinking... the economy is in the can, therefore some small coffee houses will close, therefore there might be some commercial grade machines for sale.

Sure enough, after some internet searching, I found a Rancilio Epoca E 1 group priced at $2,000. This is the same price as a new La Spaziale Mini Vivaldi II.


SO NOW THE QUESTION IS -> Go with the New La Spaziale or the Used Rancilio?

Ah, the age-old conundrum: should you buy a used commercial machine or a new one that's more prosumer oriented? The answer is "It depends."

IF the used machine is in good condition, AND you have the space for it, AND you don't mind having to plumb it in, AND you have the proper power connections, then a used commercial machine might be a good deal. However, keep in mind that most commercial machines have been used hard and poorly cleaned and maintained, so you are likely to have to spend many hours cleaning, descaling and replacing worn out parts. If you enjoy this kind of work, then have at it, but many people would prefer to just plug and play.

Also, if you need service and support, it's much easier to get a new machine from a good vendor like Chris' Coffee, who is excellent about responding to problems with the machines he sells. You won't have similar resources for a used machine, so you're pretty much on your own for any maintenance issues.

In this case, I'd be inclined to get the new Vivaldi over the used Rancilio. The price is the same, and you don't have the hassles of refurbishing an old machine with a questionable maintenance history. Plus, Chris will be there if you need help fixing something. Also, the Rancilio is a larger machine with bigger power requirements, so it's not compatible with many kitchens. The Vivaldi also has an electronically controlled double boiler, which some people prefer for ease of use and predictable results. The Epoca has a heat exchanger, which requires a cooling flush and may be a bit harder to master, though it should be capable of excellent results with practice. Both machines will be steaming demons, though the edge probably goes to the Epoca with its huge boiler.

Anyway, as I said it's a question of your individual needs and preferences, but if it were my decision to make, I'd go with the new Vivaldi. The only way I'd go with a used Epoca would be if the price was substantially lower, like $1,000 or less.

Since the Rancilio Epoca E is a plumb in machine why are you considering the Mini & not the S1V2? Looking at the specs the Epoca will be 4" taller & 5" deeper then the S1 which will take up some serious counter space. I'll admit I'm biased but I think the features the Vivaldi offers will be much more useful in a home machine then the ability to "make 70 drinks a day" with the Rancilio. Factor in the warranty, CC's excellent back up & the advice available on the S1 Cafe forum when making your decision.

The Epoca is a light duty machine, typically found in restaurants or cafes where espresso is an afterthought. So, your odds of it having been well-maintained (already low with any commercial machine), are even lower than usual. I would not buy this machine without a thorough, inside and out, inspection. Who knows, maybe it was used by a devoted espresso fanatic on his coffee cart (we had exactly such a person in my neighborhood a few years ago using the same machine at a car wash).

Consensus is to go with the La Spaziale Mini Vivaldi II.


Thanks again. You forum dudes are awesome!

Excellent choice. I'm sure you'll be very happy with it.