Hi,

I got my machine from 1st Line a few months ago. It's taken a while to get everything dialed in but I am now getting really good shots....except, on the 2nd one.

I let the machine warm up, dose and pull and its great. Now comes time for another, take portafilter off, clean and re-dose, and without fail I get coffee squirting out all over the place like there is huge channeling or the portafilter is not on enough. My first thought was the seal on the portafilter was dirty, and I clean it very well. This will not happen if I let the machine cool down in between for 20 mins or so. Is it too hot?

So what am I doing wrong...first shot great, 2nd: explosion.

Thanks for any advice.

PS I have read the long thread about this machine on here and it does not help with this problem.

Paul

Is this a bottomless PF?

Is coffee running down the side of the PF?

How long is the machine on before first shot?

What is grinder and how are you measuring your dose?

Not bottomless

Some down the side but mainly shooting out the 2 PF channels

Machine is on for 10 mins at a minimum, prob never more than 20 before first shot

Grinder is Ascaso I Steel, dose is measured on gram scale(about 16 grams) Leveled and very light tamp.

Thanks!

What happens if the machine is on for 30+ minutes before the first shot?

The only thing that comes to mind is a problem with the OPV

You are drying out the portafilter in between shots, right? If not, that might be a nice quick fix.

sourland wrote:Some down the side [...]

As a fellow Le'lit user, I have never had a good shot with leakage around the seal. If I don't tighten down the portafilter enough and water spurts out the sides, then I just give up and try again. I don't remember "explosive" shots from this, but it usually causes a lot of channeling for me. It's not normal for the portafilter to seal intermittently.

The Le'lits do seem to run pretty hot. At the peak of the boiler cycle pure steam will come out of the group head. I've never been able to decide whether this rush of steam causes channeling or just bad flavor. I do, however, try to avoid pulling a shot right after the boiler light turns off.

Thus, I would suggest two things: figure out why your portafilter isn't seating properly, then play around with "temperature surfing." I realize that you are getting good first shots. Still, for the sake of troubleshooting, some of this basic advice may help.

You might just need to crank the portafilter on tighter. Keep in mind, I turn the handle to the 5 o'clock position. This requires bracing the rest of the machine with my other hand. If it still leaks from the sides of the group head, then the top of the gasket might be trapping some coffee grounds. Here is a video by 1st-line showing how to remove the group head cover. This will let you easily remove the gasket, check it for tears, and clean all the important sealing surfaces really well.

Even if you are getting an explosion out of the portafilter spouts, it shouldn't be leaking around the sides.

As for temperature surfing, I don't perform any consistent technique. I shoot for the middle of the cooling down cycle. Sometimes the boiler turns on while I'm preparing the portafilter. In that case, I run some water through the group head until I see flash-steaming stop. Search around for some other techniques.

Good luck! Let us know if you figure it out.

P.S. Update your profile equipment! Le'lit pride!

Thanks for the response...I played around this weekend...still the same. I tried tightening the PF more and I still get the "explosion". Maybe that is too strong a word, but it does really spurt out! And the flavor of these shots are BAD. I always redo after its cooled off.
What should the temp of the coffee right as it comes out be? Rather what would be too hot? I am going to borrow a temp meter and a thermocouple from work and measure it next. Also I will try the 1st line video you mentioned.

Thanks,

Paul

sourland wrote:I let the machine warm up, dose and pull and its great. Now comes time for another, take portafilter off, clean and re-dose, and without fail I get coffee squirting out all over the place like there is huge channeling or the portafilter is not on enough.

Channeling does not cause the same result as a loose or unsealed portafilter. If the coffee is coming only out of the spouts of the portafilter and it is very weak, thin, watery or a high flow rate, the cause may be channeling. If the coffee is pouring over the sides of the portafilter body then that is a seal problem.

Since you state that both are happening, the most likely cause is using too much coffee and not elaving enough room for the portafilter to lock in. The coffee hist the screen, the PF feels tight so you stop tightening. Now the coffee is fractured by hitting the screen so both problems occur (shooting out the spouts and dribbling over the sides).

Try 15 or 15.5 grams, grind a little more coarse, and tamp harder. Hard to say that since your description of using a "...very light tamp," is not helpful. I know one pro barista to whom a 50 pound tamp would be quite light.

Sounds like a dose problem, i.e. too much coffee in the basket. Try the nickel test.

Are you doing something to fix it with the third shot, such as changing the grind adjustment? The reason I ask is I'm wondering if the first basket from the grinder has a mix of stale and fresh grinds and that the second shot has a basket of only freshly ground coffee. If this is the case, purging the grinder before the first shot may help or switching to single-dosing.

I'd recommend weighing the doses with a 0.1 g scale for repeatability.