miKe mcKoffee wrote:So if I understand you correctly your too fast shots are only a problem using double basket?

correct. i understand fill, overfill, etc. i compact fine, shots come out fine, no spraying, etc. i guess i just need more in the double basket. ive tried that too, but without a mid tamp. maybe i need to incorporate that, which i thought was only reserved for triple baskets.. lol

its too late now, just home from dinner, but im home tmw, so i will post vids then..

miKe mcKoffee wrote:West Coast and off to a right on time dinner. Just some hickory/maple/apple smoked spare ribs put on 5 hours ago:-) Just pulled the first couple half racks as they hit their 205f not quite to the falling off the bone finish target temp. (4 more racks still on gettin' there, FoodSaver Fodder ) Just need a quick grillin' to fire on a finish glaze...

long day of work :/
nice italian place for dinner though

LeoZ wrote:i understand the science behind the coffee. i dont understand why the particular type of machine, an hx, accentuates this.

It wouldn't surprise me if a pressurized portafilter or super-auto would do a better job of producing something drinkable from stale coffee than the equipment typically discussed on this site. Marketing types who advise those designing entry-level equipment have their eye on producing something when the consumer pushes the button. So the tolerances of the extraction are far wider and the pressurized portafilter prevents a complete blowout extraction.

To use an analogy, the entry level or super-auto designer is thinking of the "Wiffle Ball" of espresso machines. Easy for the novice hit, but they understand that it doesn't go very far.

miKe mcKoffee wrote:West Coast and off to a right on time dinner. Just some hickory/maple/apple smoked spare ribs put on 5 hours ago:-) Just pulled the first couple half racks as they hit their 205f not quite to the falling off the bone finish target temp. (4 more racks still on gettin' there, FoodSaver Fodder ) Just need a quick grillin' to fire on a finish glaze...

Hey Mike,
Didn't know there was someone else here that smoked, too. (Meat that is!) Maybe we should start another thread just for us 'Q' folks.

LeoZ wrote:now, i take that same coffee, same grind, and throw it in my old ass krups thermoblock. it jams the machine. i assume its b/c the krups cant output at ~9bar as the hx can. regardless, slightly more course grind, and a better shot comes out than the hx. (yes, this is relative)

wanted to explore a couple of areas..
"better shot" - in what way? less bitter? no nasty tang? sweeter? I ask that because the one thing I particularly notice is that if the head temp is too low, it tastes awful! - almost nauseating. And Krups, etc, do not run low. The HX head should be at least 200 before pulling. Also I find the larger double baskets give better, more flavorful taste. Currently using the epnw "synesso" basket, which they call a triple(I think), but I call a large double. Dosing for me is always the same - slightly overfill the basket thunking several times, Stockfleth, then just level with a finger dumping the excess into the sink. Then tamp. Also, obviously you need to verify that the pf brew pressure is, perhaps, 9.5 .

Your dosing differs between the krups and the HX, I would imagine, because the diam of the baskets is different. This may also be why you are choking the krups. If it is really not putting 9 bar to the pf, then when you do get a shot from the krups, it will be underextracted, but that may also mean "tame".

Just some thoughts. Hope that helps.


Learn Stockfleth's move.
Barista skills, then grinder, then fresh beans, THEN machine!

bill wrote:Hey Mike,
Didn't know there was someone else here that smoked, too. (Meat that is!) Maybe we should start another thread just for us 'Q' folks.

y'all smokin' ree-ubs???

i like smoking briskets.

RegulatorJohnson wrote:y'all smokin' ree-ubs???

i like smoking briskets.

Been givin' the Traeger a work-out on a re-stock the freezer smokin' spree the last week or so. Done a couple butts for pulled pork samiches FoodSaverin' baggin' up 36 samishes worth (ran out from the last butt cook NY Eve dinner ), a brisket (had for din-din last night and FoodSaver'd it up today:wink: ), whole butcher cut ham then those three big racks-o-ribs today.

I always get a kick out of those advertisements you start seein' when the weather gets nice & warm talkin' 'bout gittin' to bein' Q season. It be snowin' during part of dat ree-ub cook today. The brisket over-nighter was in the 20s warming to the 30s during next days cook finish.

I won't be without good home roast and I won't be without good smoked low & slow!

HB wrote:It wouldn't surprise me if a pressurized portafilter or super-auto would do a better job of producing something drinkable from stale coffee than the equipment typically discussed on this site. Marketing types who advise those designing entry-level equipment have their eye on producing something when the consumer pushes the button. So the tolerances of the extraction are far wider and the pressurized portafilter prevents a complete blowout extraction.

To use an analogy, the entry level or super-auto designer is thinking of the "Wiffle Ball" of espresso machines. Easy for the novice hit, but they understand that it doesn't go very far.

i live around the corner from the wiffle ball factory

Kristi wrote:wanted to explore a couple of areas..
"better shot" - in what way? less bitter? no nasty tang? sweeter? I ask that because the one thing I particularly notice is that if the head temp is too low, it tastes awful! - almost nauseating. And Krups, etc, do not run low. The HX head should be at least 200 before pulling. Also I find the larger double baskets give better, more flavorful taste. Currently using the epnw "synesso" basket, which they call a triple(I think), but I call a large double. Dosing for me is always the same - slightly overfill the basket thunking several times, Stockfleth, then just level with a finger dumping the excess into the sink. Then tamp. Also, obviously you need to verify that the pf brew pressure is, perhaps, 9.5 .

Your dosing differs between the krups and the HX, I would imagine, because the diam of the baskets is different. This may also be why you are choking the krups. If it is really not putting 9 bar to the pf, then when you do get a shot from the krups, it will be underextracted, but that may also mean "tame".

Just some thoughts. Hope that helps.


Learn Stockfleth's move.
Barista skills, then grinder, then fresh beans, THEN machine!

good thoughts, thanks..
better in more time i guess. hx machines pick up more nuances of the bean, so the bitters are more pronounced i think.

head temps should be fine, i keep the machine on all the time when im home. flushes are 5-6secs after sputtering. ive heard rule of thumb is end of sputtering indicates 206F water. basket is premade, so a quick swap with minimal wait time.

time for some coffee!!

Leoz, unless I'm mistaken, I seem to recall an earlier post of yours about the QM that indicated you had to run the grinder close to zero to get fine enough coffee -- close enough so that you could hear the burrs touching slightly. Seems to me that your grinder is maxed out for espresso. Again, on the Mini, I have tons of headroom for espresso -- I grind nowhere near zero. Or were you able to recalibrate it satisfactorily?

Any chance you could get your hands on another grinder? I'm sure your wife will understand! (over time, after the divorce is settled in her favor.)

Also I assume you've tried varying your flush routine? 5-6 seconds after the flash seems a tad short to me -- but then again, I pull 15 seconds after the flush, and it sounds like you're doing flush and go. But I assume you've played with all these variables?

If you have, I say try another grinder!

randomperson wrote:Leoz, unless I'm mistaken, I seem to recall an earlier post of yours about the QM that indicated you had to run the grinder close to zero to get fine enough coffee -- close enough so that you could hear the burrs touching slightly. Seems to me that your grinder is maxed out for espresso. Again, on the Mini, I have tons of headroom for espresso -- I grind nowhere near zero. Or were you able to recalibrate it satisfactorily?

Any chance you could get your hands on another grinder? I'm sure your wife will understand! (over time, after the divorce is settled in her favor.)

Also I assume you've tried varying your flush routine? 5-6 seconds after the flash seems a tad short to me -- but then again, I pull 15 seconds after the flush, and it sounds like you're doing flush and go. But I assume you've played with all these variables?

If you have, I say try another grinder!

i prefer the flush-n-go technique, seems more temp stable, or at least better temp control, to me. im tired of counting second after second in my head.. lol

i whined to her last night, and she doesnt seem to mind too much in a grinder upgrade. although, just pulled a shot (crappy vids coming) and all went well. the setting is down to where it sounds like the burrs rub, and i spoke to chriscoffee about it. they said as long as its not overly loud, its ok that they rub a bit when the grinder is empty, as the burrs expand when the beans get into them.

either way, an upgrade would be nice