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Help with Expobar Brewtus II flow problem

Postby Dogshot on Sun Jan 24, 2010 10:20 pm

My Brewtus II is now 5 years old, and It looks like it's starting to have prostate problems.

When I engage the pump with either a loaded pf or with a blind basket, the brew pressure goes to the opv limit (or a reasonable brew pressure) and then immediately starts to fall. As it falls, the pump becomes quieter and quieter. Eventually the pressure falls to zero and the pump becomes a whisper.

At this point if I disengage the pump, remove the pf, and re-engage the pump, the pump remains whisper quiet and there is zero water flow. I have to turn off the machine and let it sit for 10-15 minutes in order for the pump to return to normal sounding operation and to get water flow. It takes about 10 seconds for the water flow to return.

I was sure it was the opv, and so I replaced the old nylon-screw opv with the brass-screw version, with no change.

The pump will happily fill both boilers from empty, and when I test the pump's flow by volume, it produces the correct amount of water for its type of Ulka pump over the 10 second time interval. So I'm not sure that the pump is at fault, and I'm pretty sure it's not the opv.

Any ideas? I don't know what to try next.

Mark
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Postby Dogshot on Tue Jan 26, 2010 2:42 pm

I contacted WLL tech support, who suggested that I must have a clog in the system. This is what is causing the brew pressure to rise and then fall and the pump to go very quiet. They suggest that I remove and clean out the solenoid valve. The only thing is that to me it looks like the solenoid is involved in controlling flow to the steam boiler, but not the brew boiler.

I'm not crazy about getting at the solenoid valve if it cannot be responsible for the problem.

I guess I'll try descaling the brew boiler and brew path a couple of times to see if that helps. I don't mind descaling the brew boiler, but I am concerned that descaling the brew path will then require that I disassemble and re-lube the brew path. I'm also not crazy about releasing all that chrome into the brew path with the descaler.

Is descaling the brew path as well as brew boiler a good idea? Am I correct about the solenoid?

Mark
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Postby erics on Tue Jan 26, 2010 3:12 pm

You are correct about the solenoid valve - if it were stuck open, you would be overfilling the steam boiler. Exactly how much flow do you get from the group (say in 30 seconds) with empty PF in place? It seems to me as though something is amiss with the check valves internal to the Ulka pump i.e. I can't think of anything else within the system that would cause the problem you are seeing.

Have you been here? http://groups-beta.google.com/group/brewtus
Skål,

Eric S.
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E-mail: erics at erols dot com
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Postby cafeIKE on Tue Jan 26, 2010 6:24 pm

I had a similar problem. Occurred a few weeks after descale, so probably not related.
$50 to replace pump was less painful than rebuilding Ulka only to find same problem.

I also removed the in-line temperature current limit as I don't abuse the pump.
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Postby decaf_Ed on Tue Jan 26, 2010 6:49 pm

I very recently went through a similar experience with my Expobar HX system. Pressure dropped about 30 or 40 psi when the pump went silent, and no water moved out the OPV during backflushing in the silent mode. It got worse a few days after de-scaling the HX. Dissasembly and cleaning of the OPV helped, but did not completely cure the behavior. I then did another de-scale of the HX, and this time did numerous backflushes. The "stalled" pressure drop got less with each backflush, so I kept backflushing (on and off) until the system behaved normally... no pressure drop and water keeps moving out the OPV when backflushing. Took a good 45 minutes. It's been working fine ever since, but from now on I'm going to backflush a bunch when de-scaling the HX.
-Ed
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Postby Dogshot on Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:39 pm

Thanks for the suggestions. I guess I'll order a new pump from WLL. Actually, vibe pumps are probably standard issue, so I might look to find a source here in Toronto (there's a Faema repair place near the downtown).

If the machine will let me, I'll try a descale first.

Mark
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Postby godlyone on Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:59 pm

if you are going to be buying a new pump... replace it with a rotary pump.

I did it on my Brewtus II and it is hands down the best change you could make to the machine.

1. No more of that annoying noise
2. No more refilling that water tank
3. No more stagnant water sitting in that tank picking up nasty plastic taste
4. Preinfusion when you raise the brew lever half way
5. Not having the machine turn off in the middle of the shot when the water level in the reservoir drops


need i go on?
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Postby Dogshot on Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:04 am

Rotary conversion is a great idea; I really wish i had the time right now to figure out how to do it, and then actually do it. I'm afraid it's just too much right now - I barely have the time to do the basics like the opv.

You certainly make a good case for doing the conversion, though.

Mark
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Postby godlyone on Wed Jan 27, 2010 1:13 am

Well if you are going to change out the pump, putting in the rotary pump is almost exactly the same.

The only difference is you want to use a relay to turn it on.

but as far as the water plumbing, it gets connected to the same place the wimpy ulka pump does.

If you really are changing the pump I strongly suggest you switch over.. you're going to be doing the same work anyway
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Postby johnds2 on Mon Feb 01, 2010 2:03 am

I'm having the same type of problem with a Quickmill Anita.

Mine behaves just like this Anita:


I ordered a vibe pump replacement. I have never opened my machine, but will later this week.

Wish me luck.

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