EspressoForge (V1) - Review - Page 8

Need help with equipment usage or want to share your latest discovery?
samuellaw178
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Postby samuellaw178 » Mar 18, 2016, 4:01 pm

Hi Jon,

Can you share what's your flow rate profiling regime? What types of profile are you using?

In my experience, flow rate 'profiling' can only give you so much control and is more limited. It's important in the 'prebrew' state because that determines the flow rate in the later part of the extraction. However, you can also achieve that based on pressure ramp up - which is tightly linked to flow rate and is better in this case because we have a gauge here.

Most of the time, we're aiming for a typical espresso flow rate coming out from the bottom regardless of what pressure profiling we're using (that's the underlying assumption - no point getting a perfect pressure profile executed but your shot is gushing from the other side :D ). In this case(non-dialed in coarse grind), you can slow down the flow in two ways via pressure profiling/control - (i) faster pressure ramp up (ii) reduce max pressure. The aim here is to achieve flow rate similar to typical espresso flow via pressure control.

In case of dialed-in grind, if we were to flow profile the later part of the extraction, I am not sure how that can be achieved without drastically affecting the pressure (ie, you can't vary the flow rate much beyond what's possible within 0-11bar pressure and your flow control is limited by pressure). Pressure control seems more sophisticated for this purpose - more refined control and it doesn't affect the flow that much. For my profiles, I was aiming for an overall even flow rate (that usually translate to declining pressure automatically).


Oh, it's possible flow profile on the Forge if it is desired. :D Get an Acaia Lunar and their brewmaster app. The original lab ring stand for Forge can fit a scale and a cup nicely. So instead pulling the shot by looking at the gauge, you now look at your iphone/phone of choice and vary your pull pressure/rate to match the flow rate you're looking for.

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jonr
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Postby jonr » Mar 18, 2016, 10:19 pm

I have an automated machine with a variable output computer controlled pump, a scale built-in to the drip tray and software to flow profile. And a direct lever machine where I can manually control pressure or flow rate throughput brew.

I do a slow ramp up for pre-infusion (until a few drops appears - which is an indicator of flow) and after that, I prefer a roughly constant flow. This means a declining pressure, but I wouldn't want to accurately predict what pressure is needed to get any given flow (it's non-linear with time, pressure, grind, etc).

If anyone is interested, I recommend getting any direct lever machine (or an EspressoForge) and try concentrating on pressure (how hard you are pushing independent of speed or position) and then flow (how fast the handle is moving and hitting the end at ~30 seconds). Preferably over a month or more. My experience is that it's flow rate that has the most direct effect on taste with pressure being a side effect.

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beer&mathematics
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Postby beer&mathematics » Mar 23, 2016, 3:18 pm

Quick question: what's the average weight you guys get with a 'comfort-blend' on the EsFg?

I'm getting roughly 22g (~1.25 oz) with lots and lots of crema. Was wondering what the tips are to getting a tiny bit more volume (usually I'm in the 30g range). It's funny since I have almost no experience with comfort blends so I'm trying to learn to dial them in now. LOL always something to learn :)
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samuellaw178
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Postby samuellaw178 » Mar 23, 2016, 3:58 pm

I will attempt a quick answer for a quick question :P : if the Forge is filled fully you should get close or around 30g for a full stroke. Sometimes there might be air when you are filling it. To get rid of the air 100%,you can fill the first 1/3 slowly, with the Forge tilted 45 degree(or less) then proceed to fill the last 2/3 with the Forge upright in the stand.

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beer&mathematics
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Postby beer&mathematics » Mar 23, 2016, 6:25 pm

Thanks Sam give it a try!
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samuellaw178
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Postby samuellaw178 » Mar 23, 2016, 11:50 pm

Just pulled a shot in my office. Slightly overextracted (tighter than I like) but beautiful flavor/balance. :D Weighs in about 30-32g (scale showing 34g but it's off by 1-2g last I check).

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Paolo
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Postby Paolo » Mar 24, 2016, 2:02 am

Looks great, Sam!


How did it taste?

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samuellaw178
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Joined: Apr 10, 2011, 9:11 am

Postby samuellaw178 » Mar 24, 2016, 2:32 am

Thanks Paolo! There's a hint of cocoa bitterness (which I think was due to the tight flow), but the flavor is deep and balanced, with decent amount of sweetness and body. Rather satisfying. It's one of the above average shots I reckon. It was pulled steam preheated so flavor wise was quite similar to the lever I have at home - not the lower temp soft smooth comfort shot. An excellent shot from Aurora lever would get 9.5, this I guess would be on the 9.0 scale.


p/s: Mind you, it was a 'supermarket' comfort blend roast (Lazio medium roast) from Aldi . They're pretty good value if you manage to secure <2 weeks batch. Sometimes I just grab them when I got too busy/lazy over the weekend to roast. My credibility will probably go down the hill for admitting this :oops: but seriously it's a not bad blend/roast and nothing like the supermarket roasts I've tried in the past (just don't expect light juicy roast).

beananimal
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Joined: May 30, 2014, 2:55 am

Postby beananimal » May 04, 2016, 4:30 pm

Time for some new pictures.
I've put self-fusing rubber tape around the foam insulation. It is the same or similar tape used on the original V1 as I love this spiral design and the clear structure.

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After I finished it, I found that on the EF homepage there is an outdoor picture very similar to this thick-insulation version.

Personal feedback up to now:
It might be better to start with the tape at the bottom end. The look is different and the way as I started on the top, some ground coffee may tend to rest on the "ledge" of the upper side of the tape.
I is a good idea to use a sharp knife to adapt the diameter of the foam by a cone or an angle. It is easier then to wrap the tape.
If there is some imperfection on the surface of the foam, the rubber tape does not hide it.

The feeling is special. As the foam insulation is soft and with the rubber tape it feels a bit like a bicycle tube. Easy to hold and not hot at all.
Peter

samuellaw178
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Joined: Apr 10, 2011, 9:11 am

Postby samuellaw178 » May 04, 2016, 6:50 pm

Hey Peter,

Enjoyed reading your update! I have also tried a new grip material with my Forge. I've purchased a $1 racket grip (meant for badminton/tennis racket) from Ebay. It gave a superior feel for gripping than other stuff I've tried. I think they're water-proof as well (I'd imagined it's designed to withstand the sweat from players). The shortcoming was the length I ordered was a bit too short (like 2 cm short on the cylinder) but one could easily orrder a longer version of it.

Also, I find it's easier just to use the Forge without preheating. The taste is as good(in a slightly different way) and is much more convenient.